Favorite draft breeds?

I’ve heard that there is more variation within any given breed than between breeds.

I have two grade percherons that if they were red could be called suffolks. But being grade percherons they didn’t cost nearly what they would have were they red and called suffolks instead. But as horses they are just as good.

The color is kind of a vanity thing for the most part, which is fine. I think most of us admire a beautiful, matched team, and maybe most of us have a favorite color for them to be too. But it seems to me that if your aim is to use animals for work, grade animals are your best value and that age, training, soundness, and conformation are more important than breed or pedigree.

Having said that, I love black percherons. I want all the animals on my farm to be black someday so everything matches. Cats, dogs, chickens, pigs, cows, horses, and sheep. Maybe if I accomplish this, it will help me attract a stylish New York City clientele!

Treedude, I think you’ll find that smaller animals perform much better in the tropics. In Cuba, where nearly everything agricultural is draft powered, large drafts are never used–they’re all smaller, lighter animals as you describe. Or of course oxen.

@goodcompanion 173 wrote:

Treedude, I think you’ll find that smaller animals perform much better in the tropics. In Cuba, where nearly everything agricultural is draft powered, large drafts are never used–they’re all smaller, lighter animals as you describe. Or of course oxen.

Yep, the same we have here. I bought down a set of horseshoes and at first, no one would accept that there are horses big enough to need horseshoes like that – most horses here are only 4 inches across.

I did some research, the game of horseshoes orginated (they think) with the Roman Army, their horses would lose a shoe and they would gather them and use them when wore out to pitch at posts.

I couldn’t figure out the quote thing on the site so I just copy and pasted.

“I’ve heard that there is more variation within any given breed than between breeds.

I have two grade percherons that if they were red could be called suffolks. But being grade percherons they didn’t cost nearly what they would have were they red and called suffolks instead. But as horses they are just as good.”

Ah, My Good Companion, I disagree with some of these quotes.

First I agree, your horses could be just as good as a Suffolk and the implication that Suffolk’s cost too much. The Suffolk by line is “The Using Horse” but most folks that will actually use them can’t afford them. My horses don’t cost too much. I only sell young horses because once I put my time in them they are much more valuable, but I only have so much time. But I also understand how in some areas the horses are much higher than grade horses. This is why we work so many grade Suffolk horses in the woods. The people that really will work them can’t usually afford registered Suffolk horse prices. Yet they are still cheap compared to what some of the sale reports have hitch horses and show horses of other breeds selling for. Dirt Cheap, which anyone that has bought any land lately knows dirt really ain’t cheap.

There is certainly some variation within breeds, but having owned hundreds of Suffolk horses over the last thirty years they are more alike than different. This may be more true for this breed, than for others – as it is less influenced by the show ring and simply has fewer numbers in the population to present as much potential variation.

There are major differences between the European breeds despite a hundred years of American farmer’s influence.

I can speak to this from the perspective of a long time Suffolk breeder, but someone that has owned and worked all the major breeds.

The conformational difference is the split of the leg – front and rear. The Suffolk horse has the shortest cannon front and rear than any other common draft breed. You can find lots of draft horses with short cannons in the front, but look at the rear. The hock is higher and the cannon represents more of a percentage of overall leg from ground up. What a short cannon does is allow the horses foot to break over quicker and the forearm not be raised as high to take a step. This means they are more efficient. They actually travel faster with less anatomical movement and muscular effort. They don’t have the action of other breeds because the don’t lift their feet as high off the ground. The old Englishmen said it was a waste for a horse to step any higher than the depth of a furrow.

I bet there is some mule guy reading this saying, yeah that is just how my brutes move too…he’d be right…don’t dare tell any Suffolk people I said that….

The selection of horses based on phenotype instead of genotype has influenced the Suffolk draft breed, which also has one of the oldest traceable bloodlines. The Suffolk registry is second oldest next to the Thoroughbred. This means selection for disposition, conformation, tractability instead of just genes.

There is an old book about the Suffolk called “The Horse in the Furrow” written a long time ago by a man named George Evans and he quotes Herman Biddell. He says that all Suffolk horses can be traced back to one stallion in the late 16th century named Crisp’s horse in southern England. He was called a dark liver chestnut. May be just a historical myth, but it is in print.

That the English farmers developed a horse that does breed true to color is a by product of their selection and not noted to be the original goal. It was most likely just the dominant color in the foundation stallion and mares and has remained dominant throughout several hundred years of breeding as a dominant color gene. The shades of Chestnut are all over the scale from nearly sorrel to almost mahogany bay, liver and chocolate chestnuts. So yes there is some variation in color among Suffolk horses but they are all some shade of red and they are all built quite the same.

I think the most attractive thing about them is their disposition. It doesn’t matter how big, strong or what color they are, if you don’t get along with the horses you are not going to work them. They are simply the easiest horse to get along in my experience. This doesn’t mean they can’t be brats if allowed to but they are truly very gentle and exceptionally hard pulling given a chance. There are other subtle differences between Suffolk horses and any other breed. Just because they are red doesn’t make them a Suffolk.

So I guess the conclusion of this post is that Suffolk’s are my favorite breed for many reasons, more than I am willing to write about at this moment.

Ex-Motor head humorous redneck metaphor:

You can get a Ford or a Chevy, but once you have a Rolls Royce anything else is just a ride….

Thanks for reading.

Merry Christmas to y’all….stay warm

Jason Rutledge

We are trying to preserve the 16h 16-1800lb percheron. They are hard workers, intelligent, responsive, and agile. It is discouraging to see that the majority of the breed is being ruined by show breeding and ever changing breed standards that take away from it’s intended purpose. The worst effect of show breeding on their quest for the “perfect hitch horse” is the number of horses that don’t make the grade. There is only a certain number being used in hitches leaving the rest for hobby teams or pasture ornaments.
If breed standards were chiseled in stone their wouldn’t be such a broad spectrum of animals in a certain breed. Still our family treasures our traditional Percherons until we lose good stallions to continue our bloodlines.
I’ve had this discussion in person with The Biological Woodsman who is lucky his breed of choice isn’t subjected to changing standards. For this reason the Suffolk although not readily available around here would be my second choice. Tempting me to want to take Rube home with me, a fine example of a Suffolk stud colt but far from home and our full barn. Maybe someday if faced with a lack of good work stallions I would make the trip again and bring back a Suffolk colt to crossbreed our mares to maintain their work horse traits.

Whatis the difference between the Brabant and the Ardennes? We have some folks around here with Brabants but no one with Ardennes so I have never seen them only in pictures but they seem similar. Can you clear this up Simon?

How did get to talking about mules on the favorite horse page…well favorite animal would be cool.

I do have two young fillies that will be bred to a thoroughbred or a jack for the first foal. It depends on which one will make me the most money for the gestation and mare care plus stud fee. I am torn. We have two young female people in our family that really want a fancy riding horse, a thorofolk…warmblood – then of course I need for the animals to pay for their keep and care.

I read a book once entitled: “Live and Learn and Die and Forget it All”. It was a great book entertaining and full of funny stories. I forget who wrote it and have loaned it out to never see it again. It was the life story of a mule trader in the south about fifty (70) or more years ago. He told a story about his favorite pair of mules ever. They were about 1250 Suffolk mules, solid red. He told stories about taking them to livestock sales and making bets on them out pulling any other pair of mules around and when people would take him up on the bet they would hook them evener to evener with winner take all sometimes. He said he won many pairs of big draft mules that way and eventually sold the Suffolk mules for big money.

I have no such plans – but always remembered that story and wondered what a solid red pair might be worth….I could use them myself in the heat of summer, even in the Appalachians. My luck they would be male and sorrel. I don’t think they would be as tall as Belgian or Perch mules, but they would have that same determination to pull hard like their mothers.

I’ll let you know J L if I decide to sell a pair if I actually find a big red or sorrel Jack to cross them with. If not the girls will get some fancy riding horses that I will probably end up keeping their entire natural lives.

Hey Gulo, thanks for bringing this thread back up, as I had forgotten about Plowboy’s question. I was talking with Anne Harper this fall. She was breeding Brabants in Vermont in the 80’s, and is responsible for much of the Brabant blood on this continent. She now has a pair of blue roan mares.

She told me the difference between Ardennes and Brabant, is that Ardennes are a smaller variety of the same breed. There apparently is a region in Belgium called Ardennes, where for generations anytime the Brabant breeders get a horse that is a little lighter they send it down to Ardennes. In this way they keep the Large variety, and Light variety separate and true.

Carl