DAPNET Forums Archive › Forums › Equipment Category › Equipment › What to Use For A Tongue…
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- November 11, 2008 at 2:09 am #39895
TBigLug
ParticipantI’m in the process of putting together a homemade forecart for my team. What would you recommend I use for a tongue? What size and type of pipe would work? If I was to use wood, what kind/ size of post would I need? Any input would be greatly appreciated.
John
November 11, 2008 at 2:46 am #48046Crabapple Farm
ParticipantDepends a bit on what size horse and what sort of work. But it looks like you’ve got good sized horses and want to do serious work, so would be better off not trying to get away with skimping.
I’m more comfortable working with wood than metal, myself. Last winter I pulled a few Ash logs out of the wood and had a guy with a bandsaw saw them up. I had a few 4x4s sawn out of the best, clearest, straightest bit, one of which is now a tongue for my dump cart (mainly made out of the rest of the same tree). I resawed it with a circular saw to a taper, down to just under 3×3 at the tip, to reduce neck weight a bit.
For wood, Ash and Hickory would be my first choices. For weight and strength, they are great. Clear and straight grained adds greatly to the strength, which generally means sawn out of a larger log. A small straight tree of the right diameter can work fine, but per inch and pound, a sawn pole will be stronger than an entire trunk of the same size.
For metal, I think I’ve seen from 2″ to 3″. I don’t know what wall thickness you’d want.
-TevisNovember 11, 2008 at 12:26 pm #48041Gabe Ayers
KeymasterWe use a species of tree unique to higher elevations here in Appalachia.
It is Cucumber Magnolia, which is a curly grained tough light hardwood which is very resistant to weather decay. We often replace the tongues in the log arch on site out of a smaller tree that has taper in it naturally. We just whittle the thing down with a chainsaw to fit into the metal frame of the arch and drive it in with a wooden club or single bit ax. The overall length from double tree to breast yoke is about 9′ 6″ of exposed tongue.
A tongue sawn out of a clear piece of wood that is tapered is nice too.
We have hung them by the tip in the barn loft to help them dry straight and have stacked them on a flat level surface under roof also. Having a few extras makes it worth bringing a band saw onto the farm for a little custom sawing.
If you just have a few pieces to saw you could haul them to the band mill on a pickup.We don’t have but a couple of implements with tapered metal tongues, the
road grader and an old David Bradley mower. I don’t know where someone could buy one of these tapered metal tongues.November 11, 2008 at 12:30 pm #48045Rob FLory
ParticipantHi John,
You might try checking in with Tillers International in Scotts, MI. They are no doubt plugged into the local market for tongues, and the local woods.A forecart tongue doesn’t have to be as heavy as some implement tongues since a forecart doesn’t usually carry tongue weight like a mower.
Rob Flory
November 12, 2008 at 1:59 am #48043Plowboy
ParticipantWe use Ironwood poles here in N.Y. for cheap tongues. 2-3 inch steel pipe works good and is durable. Pioneer makes good tapered wood tongues for a reasonable price if you have a dealer close by.
November 12, 2008 at 2:21 am #48044john plowden
Participantlook carefully at any piece of wood to make sure the grain runs paralell the entire length – the strongest poles are riven (split) and then planed and scraped smooth – cross grain signifigantly weakens a tongue – it is well worth the extra cost – over here hornbeam works well right off the stump –
johnNovember 26, 2008 at 2:25 am #48048Anonymous
Inactive@john plowden 3485 wrote:
look carefully at any piece of wood to make sure the grain runs paralell the entire length – the strongest poles are riven (split) and then planed and scraped smooth – cross grain signifigantly weakens a tongue – it is well worth the extra cost – over here hornbeam works well right off the stump –
johnpick up a copy of Roy Underhills Woodwrights Guide….good info on handworking wood with froe and edge…
I agree on the hop hornbeam…and it’s so pretty…be prepared to sharpen whatever you cut it with though..and frequently…it’ll flat jack up a saw chain..
White oak rives nicely..but I would be worried that it would splinter dangerously if it failed under load, or if a team went down badly…
Ash and hop hornbeam would be my top picks around here..
I have the very distinct pleasure of owning a small sawmill and being able to
make pretty much whatever I want (gotta learn to make yokes at some point..I have a forge too..) Anyway..if you want to find a small independent
sawyer in your area, check out http://www.forestryforum.com or call Woodmizer
sawmill company..or I’d guess any of the other sawmill manufacturers..I personally do business with WM..good folks. A small portable sawyer is very often amenable to unusual projects and oddball one off requests…and can take time to work with you as far as tweaking and leveling the log to get best use of the grain for what you want.I will be going to sea for a few months…but I will try to stay in touch here,
and if any of you folks around eastern VA need weird chunks of wood for whatever, drop me a line, if I can’t do it, I can find someone who can…and I will gladly work on shares or barter…and will definitely work for hardwood logs…I treecycle! hmm..might work for some Cow Lessons too…BTW…the spars and restoration timbers onboard USS Constitution were sawn on a woodmizer…and no, I don’t work for them…not spam..
November 26, 2008 at 3:09 am #48042Mark Cowdrey
ParticipantI had a good sized ash log this summer that I took to a friend W a wood mizer. We sawed the center out to get rid of the warp-y, shake-y heart. Then made 4 4×4 blanks. The wany ends will be cut out when the taper is made. The tree grew on the edge of the driveway so had some reaction wood because of the unequal sunlight, not too bad, but enough to put a couple inch bend over 14′ in at least 2 of the blanks. I clamped the 4 up together W 1″ spacers, 4 sets of clamps, orienting them so that the curves opposed each other. They are in the barn under some hay right now, we’ll see how they look in the summer when I take the clamps off.
That cucmber wood souds interesting.
Good luck,
MarkNovember 26, 2008 at 4:50 am #48049InactiveThat will probably work ok…you might wet them down occasionally…keep them from drying too fast and becoming brittle…also helps to “temper” the wood…help it keep some
resilience…a few guys I know have clamp racks…basically timbers with holes drilled in the ends, and allthread bolts through…stack the wood with the timbers a couple feet apart and
clamp the boards together..stickers and all.. (the 1″ spacers are stickers..)
that works really well for larger timbers, of course if a big timber has stress in it..it’s
gonna move and not alot can be done…except find a use for shorter timbers 😉November 27, 2008 at 1:54 am #48047416Jonny
ParticipantIf you’re going to make a tongue out of metal, 2″ square tubing (1/8″ wall) fits nicely into a number of accessories. Erik Andrus and I put together a sled with an articulating pole that moves around by using that tubing, a trailer coupling and a 2″ ball attached to a metal plate lag screwed into a central beam. I think this design would be nice for horses that don’t like to step over a tall tongue, just lay it on the ground and then clip it on with the neck yoke attached.
If you’re making a heavy duty implement, many bits and pieces can fit 2 1/2″ square tubing as well.
You can also save a little bit of a headache if you have the hardware you’ll use first. It’s easier to fit the wood to the hardware than the hardware to the wood.
Just a thought.
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