a training question – young steer likes to follow behind me.

DAPNET Forums Archive Forums Draft Animal Power Training Working Animals Training Cattle a training question – young steer likes to follow behind me.

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  • #40334
    ivy
    Participant

    my steer (7 months old) likes to walk right behind me. this is how cows follow each other around in the pasture and i wonder if this is why he does it. he doesn’t seem to want to butt me (heh …) or act up while he’s in a position that i can’t easily see him, but i think it would be good if he walked beside me for safety reasons and control. does anyone have any ideas about enforcing that behaviour?

    i had been randomly offering him a treat when he was in the right postion and also sometimes holding a treat in a way that he has to be walking next to me to get it, but he doesn’t seem to be adopting the desired behaviour. should i try correcting him with the goad stick?

    thanks for your suggestions!
    ivy

    #51025
    Howie
    Participant

    In some areas they drive their cattle from the front. You should start right now to teach him that you are the boss and he will walk where you tell him to. The only treat that cattle should get while working is a chance to stop and rest, with maybe a word of affection.:)

    #51030
    Tim Harrigan
    Participant

    Cattle get in the habit of following quite easy, they seem to prefer it, it seems to me, because they do not have to think. But having them behind is not a convenient place to be because you can not see them and you risk tripping if you start walking backward. Step to the side and stay at the point of his shoulder. Speed him up with your lash if he starts to fall in behind you. Make him walk at the speed you want; quick, easy or at a walk. You should be able to drive him from in front if you want, but you should decide when and where, not him. That is a bad habit.

    #51027
    ivy
    Participant

    I wanted to post an update and say that Lucky (that’s my steer) caught on really fast after a few slaps with the rod to get him going. He walks next to me now pretty well. I have to tap him sometimes when he forgets, but it seems like another advantage of this is that if I just touch the rod on his hind-end he speeds up, no need to hit him hard. You know what they say … “spare the rod …”

    Thanks
    Ivy

    #51026
    Vicki
    Participant

    It sounds like you and Lucky are off to a great start! And you got the right idea: use only the amount of “rod” needed to get compliance. Have fun!

    #51028
    ivy
    Participant

    I appreciate this forum so much … it gives me hope that I am training something other than halter broke hamburger … but still, I have another question.

    Since Lucky has started walking next to me, he has started a pretty annoying habit, deciding he’s gonna bolt off with no real warning. This is not something he ever did when he walked behind me. Some days he does this 5 or 6 times in the course of 45 minutes and some days he never does it. I don’t think that anything is startling him (although he does sort of the same thing when something does scare him) at least, not anything that I can figure out.

    Because I keep my hand down by his halter rope most of the time, I can catch him when he starts to do this and can stop him before he takes more than a few steps (but if he gets much bigger, I’m going to be going for a ride). I have been glaring at him and telling him “no” in that firm bad-dog voice and, tapping him on the nose with the goad if i can get it up there quickly enough. A few times I let him go just to see what he would do, he runs about 10 feet infront of me and then turns around and comes back.

    He’s been doing this pretty consistenly for 2 weeks now and I’d like to stop it before it becomes too much of a habit. Does anyone have any pointers?

    #51031
    Tim Harrigan
    Participant

    He is acting like an 8 month old calf. He is also learning what he can get away with, and he is learning that he can get away with a lot. I might be wrong, but I do not think bovines give a second thought to a good glare and scolding. Your relationship changes when the yoke goes on–it has to be all business. First of all, do not let him run from you. This is one of the worst possible habits that he can learn. Keep your hand on his lead so you can snap him back if he starts to run. Have your goad ready and wrap him on the nose if he starts to run. I can’t tell you exactly how to get his attention but he needs to regret goofing off in the yoke. Do you have a single yoke for him? If so, he should be pulling something like a car tire that will make him work a little bit. If he has to pull he will not be thinking about running. If he runs with a load maybe it is not heavy enough.

    #51029
    ivy
    Participant

    Hah! Oh children … I never was very good as a teacher’s aide. I whack him on the nose pretty well … what could be more unpleasant than that? I’ll try to think of something more attention getting and give him something heavier to drag.

    I think it’s pretty interesting to read people’s animal training theories, especially if you are a novice like me. Some advocate absolute dominance but others say such training breaks the calf’s spirit, other websites I found make it sound like people train their calves with sweetness and patience and apples (my calf doesn’t even like apples).

    I have a week off from my off farm job this week so we are going to have a lesson every day. I’ll let you know how it goes.

    Cheers 🙂
    ivy

    #51032
    Tim Harrigan
    Participant

    Ivy, you need to find the right balance in taking your steer from unruly to responsive and well-mannered. Kindness predominates in all phases of training, but kindness is not always shown by hugs and kisses. What you learn in working cattle over time is where the limits need to be set, and you learn to measure your response in getting them there. It is a serious mistake to overreact in a harsh way if they do not understand what you expect of them. But, you need to lead them, in a stepwise fashion, through a learning process whereby they quickly come to understand what you want. And then you need to enforce it with just enough insistence that they clearly understand that your way is the easy way. Like water flowing over a rock.

    I am sorry if I seemed to be pushing you to a position of unyielding harshness but I did not sense thay you needed any encouragement on the hugs and kisses side. If your steer gets to where he is always testing the limit of what you will accept you will never relax and really enjoy working with him. You will see teamsters who are loud and strike their team frequently. And, you will see others who are quiet and can direct their team with a quite voice and nearly imperceptible movements. What separates them, in large part, is their ability to read behavior, communicate clear expectations, and enforce them in a clear and kind way.

    You have to realize that we have little evidence to establish our recommendations in response to questions in a site like this, and if we could watch you we may make very different observations. Most of what you need to learn is not in a book or on this site. That means we can not tell you exactly what to do. You just need to work through the process and your team will tell you what is working and what is not. Training a team is an interesting challenge because every animal is different and every team is different. You make some mistakes and you get some things right. Over time, as you gain experience, you hope to get more things right than wrong. Don’t get discouraged, but don’t let him run 🙁

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