Training an feeding question, before or after

DAPNET Forums Archive Forums Draft Animal Power Oxen Training an feeding question, before or after

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  • #43498
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Trying to work/train with my calves around their feed time. When is the best time to work with them? Mainly I’m curious as to how most work training into their schedule. What’s a good habit in training up a new team?

    #72046
    Vicki
    Participant

    I would tie and feed in a.m.; do barn chores or go back in house for 45 min. to 1 hour; then lead each to water for drink, then retie, brush (always reinforcing set out/put in, pick up feet), yoke, train/work. After session, retie to unyoke, brush briefly, then release. I recommend establishing a routine for how you yoke and expect them to be still for it. I let them free during the day.

    Howie always said don’t try to train hungry calves.

    Usually evening was when I trained the youngsters so I followed the same steps, after they’d come to feeding area for supper. Then I left them tied overnight after session.

    #72054
    Oxhill
    Participant

    Ours are on pasture 24/7. They are bribed to the barn twice a day with a small treat. Once before work and once after. They get at least one training session a day or two when my time allows. Make sure their needs are meet before training. Food water or flies. If you don’t they will be distracted. If you feed or water them only after training they will become barn sour. Training sessions don’t need to be long. In fact when they are young it is better if they aren’t. It is more important that they are trained regularly. At the moment I take them maybe a little over a hundred yards and turn around and go back to the barn. Then keep going ten yards or so past the barn the other way before finally returning to the barn so they don’t get barn sour.

    #72050
    Kevin Cunningham
    Participant

    I quickly learned not to train before feeding. As suggested it is best if they have their needs met before you try to do a session. That said I often mix it up and try to be routinely different. Most animals like routine but can also get trapped in the routine, this can be a problem if you need to do some thing out of order for some varied reason. Here is our current routine: We move fence for the cattle in the am(they get moved everyday). Then once everybody is settle in I get the boys out on halters individually (I think this is good training for driving single. We do a few turns and stops, and then they get to go to the primo pasture in another small moveable paddock for the day. I will bring water out mid day and sometimes yoke them sometimes not. In the evening I brush thouroughly and yoke the boys for chores. They haul a bale of hay out to other animals, then we do some other training; walk to the river, or the road, drive from behind, haul some rocks, or just starts and stops. They spend the night out with the sheep and cattle and get some extra brushing in the evening. That is what we are doing right now, but it will probably change soon as it always does.

    #72047
    dominiquer60
    Moderator

    Being a person of varying routine, my calves/steers also have a variable routine. Sometimes it was after morning feed as Vicki described and sometimes it was before evening chores. If it was before evening chores I would work them pass the barn as much as needed to make sure that I had their attention and not the person feeding the beef animals. This was not very often, but was a nice challenge to work through and changed things up a little once they were more handy. I was not always able to work them everyday, but I made sure that every time I feed them that they yield to me and back up before they receive their feed dish. This is an almost an automatic response now, I say almost because how I feed them has changed some since moving to VT. Since chores in VT are modeled in a manner for regular draft animal use on the farm, now they always eat first thing and are ready for work if the weather and ground conditions permit.

    #72052
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Thanks, So there’s no “silver bullet” method.
    I didn’t expect this, but I really enjoyed reading about another persons routine. To me, that’s one of the toughest things to hang onto, a routine. I’m of a “varying routine”. Luckily if I’m not able to work my steers right after feeding, I can call them back in from wherever they are and work with them. I didn’t think I trained that way, but it just happened. Their good boys.

    #72055
    Oxhill
    Participant

    The “Silver Bullet” is what you find to work for you. Every teamster has his or her own experiences and reasoning for what they do. Every teamster and every animal is different so some details don’t work for everybody. Even my dad and I are a little different. My dad and uncle where as different as night and day. Your routine will always be evolving. A lot in the beginning and less and less as you get more experience but never quit looking for a better way to do things. The best thing to do is to pick as many brains and ask as many questions as you can. Find out how they do things and why. If it makes sense to you then try it and if it works well then keep it in your routine. Drew Conroy’s and Ray Ludwig’s books should both be considered as required reading. However there are many many little details or nuances that you will never be able to pick up without watching another teamster. Since you are in Indiana anyway the MODA gathering this summer in Kalamazoo MI would be a great place to get ideas. If you watch you will see that no two teamsters are exactly the same.

    #72049
    Baystatetom
    Participant

    I feed mine first when they are young but now I hay them before working them but give them a healthy dose of grain after. My line of thinking is like a pro athlete does, the high protein snack after the workout will help build muscle. Maybe I am completely nuts but it makes sense in my little brain.
    ~Tom

    #72051
    Kevin Cunningham
    Participant

    It makes sense to think of draft animals as athletes. They are utilizing their bodies to do more than your average steer. I can even see the neck and shoulder development on my working steers as compared to the other steers. I don’t grain my steers right now but I can see getting them some oats once they are really pulling. I have tried to give them grain but they don’t seem interested in it that much. Which I find strange because the goats are always ready to eat grain.

    I try and think like an athletic trainer when working my steers as well; with work periods and rest periods. I think that with time the feeding can be fine tuned just like a pro athlete.

    #72053
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    I’m looking forward to the MODA gathering. I found that you can learn alot by sitting in the shade, with those guys that know what doing.

    I grain mine AM and PM with hay available always. Their 5 months old now. I thought I’d continue feeding grain for growth, the first year and then back off. Any ideas on this recipe ? My steers are Guernseys, so I know they will never be huge hunks of massive muscle and fat, but I’d like to do my best by them.

    #72056
    oxman
    Participant

    Training begins as soon as the animal drops out of the cow’s vulva and continues non-stop until the day you realize, the ox has surpassed you. Outdoor training should happen like youwould between meals. Train often, but not in long durations.

    Carmen

    #72048
    fabian
    Participant

    My golden rule for training my cows is:
    “Rumen filled, udder empty”

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