how do you start your horses?

DAPNET Forums Archive › Forums › Draft Animal Power › Training Working Animals › Training Horses and/or Mules › how do you start your horses?

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  • February 23, 2013 at 1:51 am #44534
    Donn Hewes
    Keymaster

    Many times I have told people that starting your team well; together, no excitement, but with energy, is one of the true measures of the art. A skill you can strive for for a long time. It is a great measure of the working relationship with your animals.

    I have been gradually changing the way I proceed, and gradually changing the way I teach others. Years ago, I was saying too much; “George,,,Eddie,,, Step up,,, Kiss, Kiss”. And to make matters worse, I don’t think I was using my hands to their full potential. The hands were sort of waiting for the horses to do something. I think as a farmer, it is easy to fall into these patterns and not really see their weaknesses.

    Today I am teaching; use your hands more and voice less. When you pick up their heads as a signal to get ready, look which way their heads are pointed; look which way you want go. Now you can pick up the heads in the direction you want to go. Moving a horses head just a little to the left or right sort of tips it off balance, this can help with a horse that has a tendency to hesitate. With the animals prepared in this way, a simple kiss or single word will release them to step off together.

    There is also an element of timing involved; or rhythm as I like to say. The rhythm of pick up the lines; touch the heads; and go. That rhythm helps the animals find a pattern and animals always like a pattern. In order to find this rhythm you need to be ready before you touch the lines.

    Also the animals name becomes a good way to reinforce for someone that isn’t listening, or hesitates in working as part of the team.

    How do you start your team?

    February 23, 2013 at 2:19 am #77583
    grey
    Participant

    For the average start, I do like you described – Pick up the lines, touch the mouths evenly on both sides, wait for the ears to check in with me, then tell them to go with the appropriate amount of energy for the task at hand. If, after I have touched their mouths, I feel like I need to get their attention just a bit more before we go (due to some distraction or other), I will say, “Ladies….” and that will put them on full alert. From there I may say “back” or “come gee” or just give a little kiss.

    When I first started out driving, I think I probably did wait for the horses to kind of “walk up into” contact on the lines because I didn’t have the hands yet. You have to take up the contact, and then give with your arms/hands/body as they push into the collars so they don’t bump their mouths as they lean to. I grew up neck-reining bridle and hackamore horses. The contact required for driving was entirely alien.

    February 23, 2013 at 10:29 am #77589
    Jeroen
    Participant

    I also start like described by Donn, a call and put them straight with the lines , but since my team is not so well balanced it often results in one horse who is attentive and the other sort of standing with the handbrake on. When work is underway it gets better. Voice commands are “Ladies”, then pick up lines and “Go” or whatever command is needed. When things are difficult we (my wife and I) have a tendency to talk to much which makes the horses nervous, so the one not leading the horses has het task of giving the “shut up” signal if that happens. My horses have a tendency to start, take turns and other actions on their own when they know or think they know what my next command will be. Very hard to get rid of this bad habit.

    February 25, 2013 at 1:25 pm #77587
    gwpoky
    Participant

    When I start my horses I never use either, as it puts them to sleep, but at least I don’t have to worry about scoring a piston:p.

    Sorry I couldn’t help myself.

    All good points above, one thing I am very adamant of, as Jeroen was stating, is my teams do not step off unless I say so. If I am unhitching and I go back to step the team away from the piece of equipment and they take a step without my command, I back them and we wait a few seconds until I say to step off.

    February 25, 2013 at 3:13 pm #77588
    Billy Foster
    Participant

    Starting is something I think a lot about. I think a lot about it because I am always working on teaching these guys to stay relaxed and still when stopped. It became very clear to me that anticipating the next move or remembering a routine was something that horses do very well. In the last year I have tried several ways to start , saying there name first, “are you ready”, then a kiss, just a kiss, and recently I have been picking up the lines and moving their heads just a little to get their ears towards me and a kiss to walk forward. I do the same for backing away from the barn. I also will get up on the forecart/equipment pick up the lines and just sit there for a couple minutes since I noticed they were getting ready to go as soon as I got to that part of the routine. Sometimes I will play games with them and climb up and off the forecart a couple times and then leave them on the barn for a ½ hour. In my mind I want them to be able to relax until I actually give them the kiss, not to anticipate it is coming.
    As far as the vocal comands, for me I have been trying to reinforce my vocal commands with the lines. Maybe this is a vestige from my dog mushing days but I like to be able to get a response from the horse (s) when I give the auditory command. Perhaps it seems the horses behavior is calmer when I give them a command verbally, with a slight reminded with the bit, than with just the bit because my line handling skills are not developed? To me it feels very smooth when I can tell one horse to step up and he quietly takes a step or tell the team to haw and they side step around in a tight spot of the wood lot. It feels like I am just reminding them of what I am asking with the bit not “making” them do it. Except from the great advice I have gotten from this forum I am in kind of a vacuum up here on our farm; perhaps my methods are not the best way to do things but USUALLY it feels like the horses and I are able to communicate pretty well. They are able to let me know pretty quick if I get off track :).
    Billy

    February 26, 2013 at 6:58 pm #77584
    grey
    Participant

    Being able to communicate with lines only and no voice is great. Being able to communicate with voice only and no lines is great also. I have been in plenty of situations where one or the other method of communication was not available or not optimal for whatever reason.

    Anyone who has ever been an unwilling passenger on a “fast trip” knows that a bit doesn’t “make” a horse do anything.

    February 27, 2013 at 12:36 am #77580
    J-L
    Participant

    I use a team by myself feeding quite a little. At times we’re stopping and starting with me off the wagon/sleigh pitching hay (or loading sod in spring) so voice is very important and I reinforce it quite often. When I’m on the implement I will use the lines also.
    This is something that I always work on and you’d think it’s the most basic and simple part of driving, but starting your team well is a whole lot tougher to master than most people think. It’s made more complicated by the scads of different jobs we use them for. Have to ease into a load most of the time, hit it hard sometimes, off the wagon with voice only, working with a motor noise and line cues only…etc. Not a simple thing!

    February 27, 2013 at 12:42 am #77578
    Carl Russell
    Moderator

    I think a good start starts with a good whoa. My basic training of horses always comes down to pressure and release. When driving I maintain slight contact on the bit… pressure.. by which I communicate my intentions. When I am done communicating with my horses in a working situation, then I whoa them and release the lines…. completely.

    Then my horses wait for contact on the bit before they even consider moving…… but as has been mentioned, I don’t touch the lines until I am ready to move. I do not gather the lines looking around, or any other distraction. I decide what I will expect from the horses, then I pick up the lines, establishing contact, their heads come up, ears back, and I kiss.

    My horses are always coming. If the load is light they feel it instantly, and walk off easily, like cultivating in a garden. If it comes hard, they are ready for it. Sometimes they don’t try hard enough, but rarely on the second attempt.

    I think that using contact also helps in managing the forward effort, like a gas pedal, and they are always together responding to the same physical cues.

    Carl

    February 27, 2013 at 1:15 am #77582
    Donn Hewes
    Keymaster

    I agree with JL, It starts out seeming so simple; but when you throw in a lot of variations, and our expectations as to what is a good start rise, it takes on much of the art of a teamster. When a beginning teamster picks up the lines and start to get them self’s ready it can be painstaking to watch, (and painstaking for the waiting horse as well). Sometimes you need to get over to the other side or reposition in some other way, and this can be particularly difficult for the beginning teamster as their animals start to “wake up”. I like to teach the beginning teamster about working around a loose horse (no harness, no lines, no head gear). What will make them move and what will keep them still while I move. Then I ask them to reflect back on that when we have lines and a log or what ever. If you remain connected (mentally aware of what is going on) with the horse or team, you can keep them still until you are ready to “pick up” the lines and go.

    February 27, 2013 at 4:19 am #77585
    grey
    Participant

    Knowing how to keep a horse still by using your body language and being able to tell when a horse is thinking about moving are two aspects of horsemanship that are very important to a beginning teamster’s safety. Hard to safely hitch or hook when you don’t have that skill.

    February 27, 2013 at 2:43 pm #77581
    J-L
    Participant

    I worked a horse yesterday that taxes me this way. Good enough horse but I swear to God he has ADD. When he is paying attention he starts perfectly, but that is only 50% of the tiime. Has to be gawking off in the brush looking for moose, studying magpies flying past, looking at cows, etc.
    With him I pick the lines up, if he ain’t listening I talk next, if that doesn’t get his attention I will just tip his head in, sometimes I’ll have to tickle him with the line. The mare he works with is a gem. Pick the lines up or talk to her and she just gets the slack out of the tugs and is ready.
    I have to admit he does better on the mower with the motor. For some reason he pays attention better then. Wierdo.
    It seems like my mules anticipate a little more than the horses. Could be my mind playing tricks on me.

    February 27, 2013 at 3:45 pm #77579
    Carl Russell
    Moderator

    I was focusing more on the “starting” exercise, but I also have those modification that come into play during work. At the landing, or when hitching or unhitching, I will ask my horses to step, or back with no line contact. I also use the same commands when gathering sap or hay, or off-loading manure, when I do not have lines in my hands.

    In these latter situations tough, the horses have been taught that this is not the same as “starting”. They are much more tentative, possibly because there is no bit contact, but they are inclined inch forward, stopping easily on voice command.

    There is no doubt many nuances to this art, which makes it so inspiring to me at every turn.

    Carl

    February 27, 2013 at 5:27 pm #77586
    near horse
    Participant

    It is amazing what horses/mules can pickup when we’re teaching/working them.

    Example – whoa trumps all other cues. Absolutely.

    As Carl mentioned – nuance. “step up” in one situation means start while on the end of a lead/halter it might mean step up through this gate opening and wait while I close it. So in my limited experience, they recognize not only the command/line tension etc but also what it means in the situation they’re in. Obviously inflection/tone is part of it too.

    The final piece is individual differences btwn animals – some can be “weirdos” as Wes put it! Got one of those too.

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