[blue80]

Any updates on the practical use of the GD forecarts, specifically the I&J HD ground drive??
Spoke with Dris at prophetstown and he gives it two thumbs up after a season of use on a mower and also single row corn picker.

Trying to save my pennies as it is pricey, and getting it here is pricier, but would love to go motorless and have an excuse to have more horses:D

Thanks for the reviews/input in advance,
Kevin

[blue80]

I like tie stalls a lot. Sometimes takes some patience initially as buddy sour horses can tend to pull back until the gear breaks, usually for me they have seemed to do this when the chain is tied lower, say only 2 ft. up. When I set up a chain almost as high as the withers, for some reason they don’t pull back as hard, rather quit before putting all their weight into the effort and breaking things….. Also patience needed for nervous horses as they can get a leg over the chain when pawing with their head down, but I try to put the chain through the front of the stall with a small weight/ball of chain on the end so the slack is always taken up.

I have been told that eating off the floor is best, even if you have a high (which would make it deep) manger. Digestive juices are increased when the horses head is fully extended and colic is reduced. Many racehorse barns are done away with the clean, high hay nets because of this…. I like just a 3 by 8 about 18 inches back from the front of the stall to keep the hay from getting pawed to the back of the stall when they are eager to get the leafy stuff first….

Also been told mangers can be bad because the saliva laden morsels grow mold and spores which can later be ingested and cause other horse problems, so ability to clean the manger is important.

We quit putting water in the stalls also 80 percent of the time.

[blue80]

Hope this is not too off the mark- like that planes trains and automobiles conversation when the person asks “Can I get a plane ticket to Dallas?” and the ticket receptionist with a pleasing smile replies, “no, there are no tickets to Dallas, would you like a ticket BACK from Dallas???”:D—-but locals here have in the past set up a shell corp. in Idaho and leased their vehicles and trailers from that corporation.
Lately these people have been pulled over by the police and fined. Even out of staters working here need to get registered in state if they are just
working on a job more than 90 days…..

Times are still changin,

[blue80]

Welcome!

Nice website, your pics had me smiling a bunch of times! Thanks, I needed that:D

[blue80]

Best luck with winter boots are Sorel Extreme. They have extra stitching and patches for snowboarding I think.

Light get around work shoes some of the Vans skateboarding shoes hold up well.

A saddle shop referred me to http://www.rockyboots.com for durability, said a lot of people were happy with them, mine are holding up after 6 months, which is usually the limit for me. I like steel toes but not in the winter. I like the cowboy boot style more and more to keep junk out of my socks and because I’m scared of rattlesnakes. Tried to go American made with Double H but wore out three pairs in a year.

I’ve kindof gone from expensive favourite boots that work well to picking up a wide assortment at 2nd hand stores, especially when going through ritzy areas in towns. Amazing what people trade in. Three weeks ago picked up a pair of Italian hikers for 12$ and spent 200 miles riding and walking in the mtns. got a deer and an elk with them so far. Lucky boots. Checked them on the internet and someone payed over 200 for them new!.

Got in the habit of putting my boots on a boot dryer at night, which seems to make them last longer and more comfy.
Can’t get enough of carhart socks….

[blue80]

Thanks Bob, the ad listing the piece describes it having a “curler to windrow material while cutting” and I couldn’t find info on this. I will recheck the pics he sent but it doesn’t seem to have any special equipment on the mower except the grass board is quite long….

[blue80]

As an option, some people in Montana have got together to form a co-op. A for profit company purchases the goods right off the farm and does the marketing and sales.
I think the producer gets 75% if I remember correctly and doesn’t have to leave the farm.
Benefits of this system include that there is enough volume to supply larger consumers such as the school boards and grocers as well.

[blue80]

In this case I suggested round pen work because your horse should primarily look to you for instruction, if he already isn’t. Round pen work establishes a pecking order with the horse that they look to you as the dominant partner in the “band.” So when they are scared (a horse’s primary defense to the unknown is flight) they will look to you for direction, instead of acting on their own discretion. Are your horses ears “watching” you?
Round pen work gives the ability to desensitize to a plethera of objects in a short amount of time, and when the horse decides to make a decision, you can give them a “break” from training by running in circles at speeds and directions which you command to get rid of some extra energy. They learn that the center of the round pen being handled, flexed by you gives less pressure than being driven around a pen. And of course, being ridden vs. driven is a milestone for a horse that has only been ridden.
I have had horses that took two hours in the round pen to give me complete attention, and some that took 5 minutes. Later, a tune up often only takes 5-10 minutes….

Putting lines on them in the round pen is a great way to start, so they get used to being driven from behind and beside them, and establishes voice commands. Rarely will their be an occasion where the horse will feel pain in their mouth, unless they step on a line. A solid “go” and “Whoa” is best taught in the round pen in my opinion. Lynn Millers books show how to do this very well, and at what point a horse is ready to start “working”

And as Donn said, the horse may be bored. I have just started working an 8 year old mare that has never driven. She has shown me that pulling a tire, drag, slip, and telephone pole gets boring after a short time, like 15 minutes. She starts looking around and making her own decisions. So I hooked her up to the disk, and she loved it. But didn’t have her ears on me. another 1 hr. in the round pen and she is looking to me for instruction again. But sometimes she still doesn’t stop backing up when we stop;) Her mouth is even softer than her “broke” partner, she backs up to relieve all pressure I think, and because she thinks it’s ok…..

I have doc’s videos and can send them to you if you want, they are good but have put many to sleep…. I prefer Clinton Andersons’ 3 hr. “road to the horse” which is entertaining and shows a lot of options in a short time.
There are lots of ways and different options, sounds like you are well on your way.

If you have a certain boogeyman they can’t get over, I have no problem waiting a little to feed them, and then feed them on top of the boogeyman. Feed them in a trailer, water puddle, sprinkler, pipes, whatever, They decide pretty quick on their own that they want a meal and work things out on their own….

[blue80]

Hi Brian, and welcome!

In addition to the above excellent suggestions, depending on the level of trust you have with your horse, some round pen training may also be in order? The horse should, as mentioned, look to you for guidance. They show they are paying attention to you during a working situation mainly with their ears. If they are worrying about everything/something, they are often just forgetting to look to you for instruction. The round pen natural horsemanship techniques establish/reaffirm this working trust quite effectively, as well as flexion.
A great way to rest regroup and relieve tension for the horse and teamster is stand with your hand on their rump. Think this is a Doc H trick I use(so I tried this with my wife but the tension during a disagreement didn’t dissolve:confused:)
If the horse decides to back, stop or make a decision without your lead, and the decision of the horse isn’t going to hurt anything, you may quickly use your verbal command to maintain/establish some control over the situation and just work through it. I think that is a Lynn Miller trick I use when training, consistency and patience being the key.

It’s always interesting to learn if a horse is being belligerent, scared, or other emotion. Sometimes a well placed snack/reward-not a bribe- at the right time brings focus back to you just before a tough task is required from the boogeyman…

Kevin

[blue80]

I would say depends on what kind of forage you have. A lot of articles and options out there dealing with fall cutting and baling vs. clipping vs. leaving it stand vs. cut and leave it in a windrow to graze off….
ie. alfalfa don’t cut it within 30 days of a hard frost or it will be trying to regrow and at hard frost, the roots will not have the reserves to have good winterhardiness….
Couple thoughts, leave it stand option will catch more snow, in Gillette Wy. I see they leave strips uncut in their meadows.
Clipping also clips weeds and keeps them from going to seed, also leaves a little residue for moisture retention next year.
Studies I’ve read state that if you have at least a 1/2 ton/acre estimated crop, cutting it and leaving it in a windrow to graze off will provide much better quantity of forage than grazing uncut pasture, and saves off baling costs.
One study I read showed how getting a 4th (or last) cut of alfalfa late in the year actually would be that much less first cut the next year; which some people want, because it is the first cut which is so heavy and hard to get in dry…..

Kevin

[blue80]

:DI have a 7ft 14 disc adjustable. When set aggressively it is too much for a pair, my pair anyways, on heavy ground.

So I bought another horse:D

[blue80]

Good idea with the overlapping.
I was taught when broadcasting seed always spread 1/2 rate, and run the second pass perpendicular…. We usually culitpacked our alfalfa to get it buried 1/4 inch, and the old timers (saying this respectfully) were emphatic that we cultipacked both directions. They said it was imperative for best seed contact. This also made a small grid pattern in the soil, and helped cup moisture for the seed to germinate. These guys said in many cases, better stands can be achieved with broadcasting over use of seed drills, but then “agribusiness” suffers….

[blue80]

I’d do some simple compaction tests with a t-post and post driver. Even good soil compacted with a rubber tire scraper/pan during the construction phases will perform poorly for years to come.

Sometimes herbicides have been used on berm areas to burn down growth, therefore the weeds that grow aren’t thick???

I’d do a soil test with a lot of samples and find out what you are actually dealing with. Under proper site preparation condition, usually all organic matter is stripped from a building site, then compactable/structural fill is brought in to meet elevations for slabs and parking lots etc. The berm of topsoil remains for landscaping etc. because of the huge costs of hauling it away. I would hope your soil is great topsoil, just heavily compacted….

Rototilling lots of manure/peat/sand into the existing berm can give you some tilth quickly if the soil is heavy.

My brother and his wife started a community garden this year and it has been a real success for those involved. About 14 families on a 1 acre plot in the middle of town.
Best of luck, sounds like you have some time to plan properly before next year.

Kevin

[blue80]

I come across a lot of teams that are “kid broke” but haven’t worked in a year or two. Or “amish broke bombproof team” that has only pulled a wagon for the past several years. It seems such teams can obtain some pretty bad habits during their down time. Life is full of excuses, beware of excuses why a team doesn’t stand or work well at sale time…You are going to have to work these bugs out..

It is nice to make a couple trips to see your prospective horses; out west, teams for sale seem to be a consistent 5 hr radius drive so this isn’t really possible….but some other thoughts,
1/ If you make your first trip to see them casual and enjoyable, a check for conformity, health, and interview the owner, they may
act completely different when you come to harness them next time.
2/It’s nice to get the owners permission to drive by the property and check them out from the road, see how they move and interact in the field
3/Find someone trustworthy to purchase from. I was sold horses that were drugged at the sale, and drugged also before I returned with a trailer to pick them up. I didn’t really care, just choose not to do business with them again; for $150.00 I was was getting what I paid for….The owner didn’t even know, the trainer took the responsibility on himself to do this.
4/If they are mares and the owner doesn’t know how/when they cycle, chances are the owner hasn’t done other health diligence….
5/It is nice to be on site early for the owner to catch, lead, and harness the team himself, I like to sit back and watch how things go. Let the owner talk, and watch how the process works in the horses environment without them worrying about you and your new smells and processes…..
6/Horses that have been resold a lot may have a reason….Be sure to get the previous owners contact and give them a call. This can be invaluable. Sometimes a great teamster and working environment sells a team to someone who spoils the team. Sometimes you can get a good deal on a team ascertaining that it is the owners lack of ability rather than the horses….
7/Nice to get near a busy highway, within a fenced area, and also near some shiny equipment. Amazing how some bomproof horses well trained can be scared to death of chrome….!
8/NIce to find out who the farriers have been, they can often give temperment advise on the horses.
9/If they are an older well broke team just not suitable for heavy work, this may be an excellent choice for you. In this case I would recommend a round of bloodwork through a veterinarian. Red blood cell counts, kidney function, liver assesments, worm counts, etc. can all be given an overview. Some horses work healthy till 17, some till their late 20’s. Nice to get a health picture of what they are doing.

Hope this helps,

Kevin

[blue80]

did you get those horses from de iiiiiislansz mon?:D

looking forward to your ground drive study. I have been drooling over the IandJ heavy forecart with battery/solar aux hydraulics, but also instead thinking of making a heavy duty walking beam PTO cart out of ground drive fertilizer spreader gear….I would think your #7 would have better power to weight ratios though.

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