[LStone]

Carl,

I hitched them taking your advice about disconnecting the rope after backing in and hooking. Thank you, I think you were on to something there. When I set them loose in the tugs after they were hooked they seemed to plane out a little easier when moving and the lines got a little better for me. I think that maybe the rope may have been too tight on some hitches, causing confusion for me after I would have the lines adjusted from the last hitch. Anyhow, we go out again this weekend so this will be the big test for consistancy, and logically I think that consistancy is what I am looking for.

Larry

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I am re-floating my last post. Are there any comments on it? The kids are done eating and I have a cople indoor chores to do before I go play today.

Thanks
Larry

[LStone]

Thanks again for the advice here. I have been out a couple times to implement the ideas you all have given. I baselined my lines to 8 inches longer on the stub than the draft lines. Felt way different and I think was better. I noticed that there was still slop in one stub rein and before I adjust an inch or two to get rid of that I want to make sure that it is too long rather than the other being too short. I think I found another thing that I am doing that would influence this adjustment.

I was given advice that on a young team to run a line from the lower outside hames ring around back through the harness breechings to the opposite hames ring. I noted that I may be inconsistant with the taughtness of this line on any given hitching. You can see what I mean by the broad side pictures I posted in my original post here. I am thinking that this line would influence greatly the line adjustment based upon it being loose or tight.

I am thinking if the concept of the line is a good idea. It seems to work and be necessary, but the device (the line) I am using may not be optimum. Instead should I use a hames strap or the like fastened to the inside of the breeching of both harnesses to keep the horses together and parrallel to the pole? It would allow for a more consistant hitching. If not I’ll continue to do as I am and adjust as I think appropriate.

Thanks again,
Larry

[LStone]

Donn and all,

Firstly I want to point out that I don’t want anyone to think I was complaining about the weather here. Although I did refer to its circumstance, I am full mission capable in all weather conditions and expect my tools to be as well. My heart goes out to the people in the “Red River area. Poor souls, They probably haven’t shared on this site recently and I am sure they take little comfort in the fact that my mud may dry out a little today. In fact they are in the middle of many more important things that few of us have experienced or can appreciate. But it is what it is, God’s speed to them.

That said Donn, Yes 42 inches sounds about right. I can double check and start from scratch again today using the same hitch. I have heard the 8 inch measurement before and was using it as a guide and not a rule as I think you suggest. I was aware that horse size came into play and it does in my case (just my luck). That is where I think I confuse myself and the headaches start. If you have an easy way to figure my way through that I would really appreciate it. I have aiming for getting their heads over the center of the neck yoke. That always seems to be effected by the line adjustment I make. that is all logical but I am having trouble with figuring how the bits vs. collars/shoulders should layout. If the bits are even the collars/shoulders aren’t aligned evenly and vica versa. How do we reconcile the center of the neck yoke / bit / collar, given two different size horses. I have generally tried to guesstimate a stupid medium but I am generally unsuccessful (no real suprise there). Anyhow I will be spending the day with them and take pictures again of my handy work and post. Feel free to chime in with suggetsions.

On the harness I keep a small line spreader. Not a big fancy one with lots of rings Just a short leather strap with a ring; About four inches long. Now when I hook to a tongue my lines go through the ring on the spreader, and that moves my team apart. Go through the ring on the hames and that brings them together. I don’t have to adjust my lines that way.

Also Donn I didn’t understand much about this. Could you post a tongue / no tongue scenario highlighting this line spreader?

Thanks for trying to help me work this out.

Larry

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Hi Donn,

I did think something was wrong Saturday and was continuosly after the rein adjustment. No I wasn’t actively looking for help with that but I am having trouble with that exact thing and I would be happy to take advice on this. So the short answer is yes, please help me as this is in my opinion a big problem of mine.

[LStone]

Fun yes, dirty yes. But as you know this weekend as a wash out and still raining. It rained Friday into Saturday and the way to the barn is through the mud. I watched Les Barden’s D-Ring video this weekend, so now I know the “how to and where froms” of measuring the front traces. Guess I’ll turn to on getting those harnesses to fit better. I was partly holding off because they are young and growing as well as the fact that I really haven’t been pulling much weight until I got the big wagon so I better concentrate on it a little more now.

Larry

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@Biological Woodsman 7489 wrote:

Jen,
Invent your pasture drag to be made of something besides old tires. I have read that when tires wear they leave cadmium in their paths and that is not something you want in your ground or environment in any amount. …..

Jen Congradulations on your progress. I’d defer to Jason on the tire drag. It seems to be to be logical that something like that would be possible. Also I would think it to be a little more aggressive than you would like. I use a simple section of chain link fencing chained to a singletree for my purposes. It worked well on the dirt driveway and tried it on the small pasture with my yearling this weekend. finish product was satisfactory. We’ll see about the success of last years grouond cover bouncing back. With everyhting I’ve read it will probably fare well.

LStone

[LStone]

OldKat,
This is the people mover that “Dubba” posted for sale on this site. I make it about 7 feet wide and 14 feet long. Offhand I am not sure of the running gear rating but it is a nice ride.

I bought the hay wagon from him as well and changed it over to a team pole. The Shakedown cruise was last night. On Saturday We are going to haul home our own hay about 3 miles / relatively flat. The hay wagon is light in comparison to the people mover and I plan on 50 bales to see how they handle it. I’m bringing the truck and hitch tongue in case I need back up but I think they will be OK.

I am working on the picture part but none yet. Maybe some action shots after Saturday.

Larry

[LStone]

OldKat,

I have experienced a lot of what you are seeing with your team. My filly once harnessed wouldn’t move forward to save her own life. She is the one I referred to once in this group as the “herky jerky” filly. I ended up getting her to go with help from someone on a lead rope, but even with that at it took a while. I thought she was herd bound to my gelding because it was only a month or so after getting her to my place that I started her up, and figured the move was hard on her with losing friends and gaining new ones etc. But actually I have no idea of what was wrong or why she came out of it eventually. She still isn’t very good at being tied with blinders on and is leary of anything new to her. This included all of what you pointed out and some old standbys such as flapping flags, Snowmobiles, snowblowers, and Oh by the way air blowoffs on commercial trucks. I never even thought of that one until it happened with both my bigguns hooked to a forecart. Neither one of them had any tolerance for that and it happened at the most perfect time possible.We learned together that time and most of my life was reviewed, but I can’t wait for it to happen again. This winter I had two of my three horses side by side with a snowblower for a time. I don’t know that it helped permanently but the later passes were handled quite a bit differently by them than the earlier ones.

There have been many good posts on this subject and the only other things I would add if not already covered are to be alert for potential fear triggers and I increase my verbal communication with them to try to get them to split their attention between me and the fear. I have found that it might help in deadening the negative reaction, but what do I know? Try to find what they are skittish of and spend time with them to desensitize them of the fear. There are grunches of things for these guys to be afraid of and every horse has a different threshold of what bothers them. I imagine it will take a long life with the same horse to figure out and cure it of all fear, even if you are fortunate enough to find them all. So Just keep digging at it. In my limited experience I have kind of adopted a (time+miles=success) philosophy. It isn’t how you get to “success” but it is the fact you get there at all.

Oh yeah, then there is the confidence thing. That I am sure you have read about many time around here.

Larry

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Awesome Carl!

Thank you very much. I think this is a good idea too.

Larry

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Patience Ed. Im no pro but in my opinion this too shall pass. Unless someone gets hurt there is nothing to worry about here. They are just forming the new heard and rearranging the paygrades. My guys were the same way when they came together and they are still working it out a year later. Gelding, mare, and colt; each has a place. Personally I feed hay in one pile and let them work it out. The little guy doesn’t go hungry by any means. Watch and study their language and enjoy the spectacle.

Larry

[LStone]

Thanks for the all of the advice and to Jason and for re-floating this post. Yes, although I have had Standardbreds on the track in my earlier years (teens and 20s) and my dad had the experience and I deferred to him when making the “real” decisions regarding them and their training. I do consider myself inexperienced with horses to the extent of the knowledge they provided me over these years of exposure and from the perspective of a guy taking care of them in his back yard for only three years.

I own three Belgians, I am by no means a man of formalities but at this point in their young lives I consider everything to be part of a “training process”. I don’t consider myself a horse trainer but I am holding my own and will succeed at having my horses meet the standards of our culture when all is said and done. I am armed with only simple tools such as experience, advice, common sense, patience, and repetition. I respect and admire those who know more and are more seasoned than I. It is part of the “respect your elders” lessons learned as a youngster. I have done a lot by myself and I am wicked proud of my accomplishments with them. It is what it is, and I view it as a hobby for my own purposes, useful to me on my own terms if not practical.

My goal is to pull what they are hooked to eventually. I am taking my time with them as I find that working with the horses does wonders for my blood pressure and temperament. The pavement to me is an issue; but the exposure to traffic is what I think I am really after in the experience. I generally travel about 5 miles on the roads once, or twice a week with the forecart. Thus my question. How much is too much?

Carl the advice of stopping to rest and starting on a hill is an important piece to the puzzle. I thought I saw you write something similar in past posts but my thinking was that if they pulled the hill completely then they knew they could do it and would not shy from it in the future. But my point of view may have been flawed. In other words are you saying to lead them by showing them that they can do the tasks I ask of them and that a single task may not be limited only to the end points of a hill? I should show them that the task at hand should be defined by me and not by the hill? I will show them they can do multiple tasks linked together within the confines of the reality of the hill? I got it. I wasn’t aware that if they could pull it up the hill then they could also hold and start a load on the hill as well. Or at least I figured I would do that at a later time when they were further along.

Gordon…. Kettlecorn? That and peppermints and you’d get along with my guys just fine. 😉

Thanks for all the good feedback. I hope one day to be able to contribute more to this group.

Larry

[LStone]

Ask and ye shall receive. Even sometimes before ye ask. Erika thank you for your last post on the Alarming Law Proposed thread. “Community Supported Agriculture” was in the link you attached. I guess I was off base. But now I know. Or at least I am closer to the answer.

Thanks Again.
Larry

[LStone]

Point of education. The abbreviation “CSA”, what does it mean? I read it in Erika’s post on this thread and other sources dealing with farmers markets and Co-Ops etc. but not being very aquainted with selling farm produce etc. I am not familiar with the term. In this context would it be a “Consignment Sales Agreement” or similar? At least that is what I have managed to piece together. Thank you all for the knowledege and experience that I gain here.

[LStone]

I’m with you Elke. I do switch them around lately but when I started my two together I went with experience on the near side who happened to be the bigger of the Two. Now, not that there was a whole lot of experience in a then 3yo or a 2yo but the logic seemed right. A year later I have the bigger 3yo on the off side with the experienced 4yo on the lead. I think it is a trust thing in my case. But I have been known to move them in and out and mix up the road routes I take to suit my trust level.

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