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Robert MoonShadow
ParticipantAahhh, good… the thumbnail thingy worked. Now I feel smart. :p
ParticipantI’d be very interested in knowing more about the working donkeys.
And welcome aboard!ParticipantSeems to me that an answer to what to do with your horses/mules is already supplied by others here: Some need work to do, some need extra help to do it. Even if neither are near each other, the idea still applies: If you’ve got an idle horse or team, it seems to me that you shouldn’t have much trouble finding a nearby farmer with broken equipment or not enough time that could sure use the help… neighbor. Unless, of course, you happen to live in a part of the country where all the farmers have their work done right on time, all the time. :rolleyes:
Sure, he might need 60 acres hayed & no time/equipment to spare to do it (for example)… but I think he’d appreciate you & your single horse or team mowing 5 acres, huh? I’m just suggesting that instead of just looking for things to do with your animals for yourself, there’s plenty of opportunities to help others… and make an impression of the value of small, animal-powered farmers as neighbors = important when the next government-sponsored stupidity comes along (NAIS?), or you need help, yourself.
Just a thought.ParticipantIf there’s a college nearby that teaches webdesign, offering to be a class-project or alternatively, hiring (very low cost) a student to design it as part of their class work, can yield good results. I did this with an ad campaign for my landscape business – cost me about 3 restaurant meals & $100 (mostly in beer – hey, they’re college kids) & increased my sales by 31% that year. {Also hired a business ed major to track the ad responses).
May 5, 2009 at 4:55 am in reply to: Log Arch – Includes Discussion of Different Designs and Uses #52086ParticipantSo the Barden arch makes for an effective forecart?
ParticipantI’d pick keeping them under the ‘sustainable Farming’, with their own sub-headings = it’d intuitively be where I’d expect to find them.
ParticipantCarl ~ Are you requesting opinions on this?
ParticipantNow Donn, I could’ve sworn that I posted a comment on your srticle in some thead here…
Guess that ear scratchin’ must’ve felt so good the old mule came around for more. :pParticipantPlowboy; Personally speaking, I’m glad you feel comfortable enough here to openly speak your views. Besides, you raised some valid points.
Participant…Or it could just be a warning to the other pigs to behave themselves & stay within their pen.
Participant😀
Bivol: I’m going to assume that you mean “brake”, as in stopping, not “break”, as in the present tense of the word “broke”. Thanks for sharing the information. You post a lot of interesting things – I hope you keep it up!ParticipantGeoff; If you get down into a 60 or 70 foot deep hole, as old-time (pre-well drills) well DIGGERS did, it gets quite chilly… add cold sub-surface water on a successful dig and… you get the phrase mentioned. :p In line with your ‘really old’ adages: “When Christians were lunchmeats for lions”.
One of my favorites about not messing with things best left alone:
“Thou shalt not anger dragons… for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup.” 😮ParticipantRod; I do thank you for trying to explain it.What I’m not understanding is what benefits this has over a different approach – it seems from your postings that it’s mainly time & convenience (for the trainer). I have a question: Do you see a difference in the animals that have been trained in the different approaches? I’ve seen the difference in dogs that I’ve had to encourage to take to water – we cross a lot of streams in trailwork. I’ve leashed some up & dragged into the creek until they’ve been “desensitised”, and others, I’ve taken about the same amount of time and went & sat in the creek until their desire to be with me overrode thier fear & they decided to approach. One dog, I had to, for it’s entire life, order it across a stream & it would go… Nell (the one I have now) dislikes water, but swims out into the Salmon River to be with me when I’m swimming. Same approach for my pack donkeys on fording creeks = I let them figure it out, by leading the others across first. I don’t see the difference in time spent.
Ronnie; I recognise & respect my animals’ abilities to think things out – to reason – and don’t consider that to be “touchie-feely”. I don’t “break” animals… I bend them to my desires, which I think, takes quite a lot of skill – of which, for equines, I am lacking (for now). It’s the same when I cut a live tree for firewood = I recognize that I’m taking a life, and out of respect for that, I don’t waste it. I am not a “treehugger”; I’m a Pagan. So, for me, it’s not about “touchie-feely” or “breaking” – it’s about respect – whichever method that is effective & efficient, while maintaining or increasing the respect and admiration I have for these animals that put out so much effort on my behalf. I also recognize & respect that most others don’t feel this way. But instead of “forcefully leading” a mule into various situations to desensitize (numb) it, I’d sooner take about the same amount of time & quietly lead it up near to the highway & let it figure it out on it’s own. Or better yet, pasture it near a busy road, if possible.
Now I may be way off base with this, but here it is: I honestly suspect that Jennifer, once she has Peanut & Reno healed up & trained the way she wants, will actually be able to consistantly get more out of her horses than a team that’s been ‘broke’ to harness, perhaps within limitations of Reno’s injury – but maybe not even that.ParticipantWhile I was in prison, I wrote to Lynn, asking how much a single copy cost – and instead of replying, he sent a free copy… I wrote the magazine a letter requesting information (or sources of same) on farming with donkeys, explaining that being in prison, my ability to locate any info was limited. He printed the letter, and not one, but two different people chose on their own initiative to pay for a 1-year gift subscription for me. I never heard much on actually working with donkeys, but the generosity and willingness of not just this company, but the community it represents, impressed me.
And I find the Nordell’s articles, and information gleaned from the letters sent in to be quite useful at times. It also put me on a trail that eventually led me to this site.
I’ll keep my subscription going.ParticipantI’m trying to understand why to use this method in the first place; it was mentioned early on in this thread that one of it’s ‘benefits’ is that it turns out workable animals in a short period of time. But that, to me, suggests a lack of planning: unless it was some sort of catastrophe that wiped out the farm’s entire stock, then why so shorthanded in mules as to need some trained so quickly, and thus need to use a shortcut method? As the saying goes: “lack of planning on my part does not constitute an emergency on anyone else’s part.” I never spoke that the idea of this method was to purposely create fear; however, it seems an inherent byproduct of it. Or else, why the need to tie the head high to prevent balkiness? As I said, I’m NOT trying to argue {will, in fact, refuse to do so}; I AM trying to understand. I just think that an animal is more trustworthy and also gives more of itself, when it wants to do something, and not just because it has to. Creating or finding that source of motivation in an animal is, to me, something that approaches true art. Definitely a fine craft. That belief will not change when I finally move to the level of deriving my livelihood from working with draft animals (in my case, donkeys) – because I derive my livelihood now from my own labor –> the donkeys will only ease my labor (on some levels, and increase it on others) and increase my overall productivity – but I will still take the time to train them through other methods; I demand & expect excellence from them… and myself. So, can/will someone explain to me what the benefits of this method is, as compared to taking the time & effort (and patience) to working through the balkiness (if it even developes)? Is it just a time issue? Or is there something about this method that produces superior animals? I can’t watch youtube videos (but will try to at the library), so my understanding of this method is limited to the words & still photographs that have been posted here. I would really like to understand what it is about this that has so many adherents to it, here. I want to thank you all that have contributed to this thread… it is very interesting.
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