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sanhestar
ParticipantHello,
they say that the foal won’t grow too large in the uterus to be birthed without problems. But I’ve also heard otherwise. Not sure if I would be willing to risk it.
I would go the other way round – Welsh stud to Fjord mare – enough room for the foal to grow.
Or you go long-term over 1 or 2 generations, starting with a slightly larger stallion, then breed the – hopefully female – offspring to a full grown Fjord stud.
Participantwell treatable but only if caught in time.
What happens during a phlegmon is that bacteria destroy the connective tissue between the cells therefore a untreated phlegmon will leave chronic swellings – often for the rest of the horses life.
They are also often accompanied by fever and general infection when the bacteria enter the bloodstream or lymph vessels – nothing to play with.
But could also be a undetected break, muscle, sinew or joint damage – diagnosis is important to determine the course of action.
ParticipantRobin,
sorry to be so brisk but a vet should have a look at your horse – soon!
Participantdepends on breed and size (obviously).
The goats that are bred for packing can weigh up to 250 lbs.
ParticipantHello,
most people don’t know that goats will grow until 4/5 years of age because most of them are butchered way before that resp. does that are bred too early (first year) stop growing often after the first lambing (too much strain on the body) if not fed properly.
for comparison: I’m 1,75m tall, all wethers kept growing after that picture was taken. They were 3 years old then, except the white one (2 years, poorly raised when young but he cought up over time)
Participant@bivol 8058 wrote:
2. they mature faster. a goat can be fully mature by a year. a donkey takes a few years to be able to do hard work.
I’m sorry, but that’s wrong. A goat needs 4 years (sometimes 5) to mature and before being able to do hard work. Taking a one year old goat to work is simply cruel.
I would suggest reading “The Packgoat” from John Mionczynski, there’s a chapter about the economy of working goats vs. horses and oxen (required food intake vs. work “output”).
ParticipantHello Rick,
I don’t think that yokes would work with goats. Their neck/shoulder structure is more similar to horses than to oxen.
Collar or harness is what’s been used – check the foto section on the harnessgoats.co.uk website – lots of interesting ideas there.
Participantno, I refer to this type of panels:
can’t remember that I’ve ever seen the type you describe over here, at least not for cattle.
Participant@Robert MoonShadow 8035 wrote:
You didn’t mention how much area you’re wanting to fence in at your rental… stock panels (also called ‘cattle panels’) aren’t cheap (about $20 hereabouts)
I would love to buy stock panels at that price. EUR 118,– a piece or more!
ParticipantHi,
they can pull up to twice their weight.
ParticipantHello Gordon,
although it’s often recommended to keep goats with horses it’s not natural for either goat nor horse(s).
– horses can seriously hurt a goat: kicking, biting but also simply stepping on the goats feet (have experienced this myself in the first years of goat husbandry when goats and horses ran in the same shed. You may believe me that it’s no fun to have the blood squirt from the goats foot while still under the horses hoove)
– horses and goats have very different social behaviour and even when the goat will bond with the horses (from pure necessity) she will remain lonely. Also, there’s no need for the horses to bond with the goat – them being an intact herd.
If you’re already thinking about a second nanny, do it. Although I still recommend to keep the wether because it’s a more natural herd structure (females with one “almost” male). And then you should think about a forth (even numbers are better in small groups, less chance that one animal is singled out) – so you see, already on the way to goat addiction 🙂
As for her milking cycle: she’s three months into it and at that time milk production for lambs will decrease.
ParticipantHello,
also check
mailinglist on yahoo
Harness goats
You can find one article on training harness goats per issue in the packgoat magazine “Goat Tracks” (3 issues per year – a lot of info on training also in the back issues)
http://www.goattracksmagazine.com
good information on goats in general, training, behaviour
“The Mysterious Goat” by Dr. C. Naacktgeboren
http://www.bbpress.nl/livestock/mysterious_goat.shtml
google for American Harness Goat Society, they have a small manual on training goats to harness
In terms of training:
the most important work is to properly socialise them to humans (or buy well socialised goats). These type of goats accepts any challenge with ease, you won’t find spookiness towards equipment, like in horses.
One example: when I put a saddle on my packgoat prospects this is a thing of 5 minutes. One look, a bit awkward moving – a mental “shrugging” and that’s it.
Training goats to pull is very similar to teaching them to pack.
Training goats to be driven though can be a challenge because they are really fast in their reactions and will have themselves (and you) tangled in the lines in no time. So you should have helpers, patience and time for this kind of task.
But “simple” pulling with you walking beside them is an quite easy task – given that they are trusting you.
Participant@carter 7925 wrote:
I notice most names end in ‘vieh’ , so I’ll try to see what that means. I shall have to watch out, I can feel myself being tempted down the oxen road….
Hello and welcome,
“Vieh” means livestock but it’s also used to describe cattle in particular.
So f.e.
Fleckvieh = piebald, pinto cattle
Braunvieh = brown cattleall in regard to local breeds
ParticipantHello,
there’s also a very knowledgeable mailing list on yahoo called “holistic goats”
On another topic: goats are very sociable herd animals. You should consider keeping the wether permanently – can become a good working animals for smaller tasks around your place. Keeping a goat alone is almost cruel, especially when she grew up in a herd.
As for milking: the amount of milk depends on food, water intake and stress. Do you feed the same she got at her old place (quantities, quality, brand resp. ingredients)? If not you may consider getting some food from their to make a slower change of her diet – especially regarding the concentrated food.
How far along is she in her milk production – meaning, when did she kid? Milk output will drop a bit after the first weeks after lambing
ParticipantRod,
that’s what I meant. The ox looks like in need of a worming.
You’re right, too. With the shedding of the winter coat they look often shaggy, that’s why I asked – pictures can be deceiving.
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