Are round staves a solution for a "bowless" country

[fabian]

Up to this time I use unpeeled rattan as stuff for my bows. I’m medium satisfied with them. I can haul out the two axled waggon with manure with the cow team, but I think that I can not use the whole power of the team without the risk of bending the bows.
Then I tried to bend wooden bows from white ash. Ihave a professionel steamtube, which not only produces steam but also pressure. After some more or less successless attempts the last bending worked satisfying. But bending is it not alone. The effort after bending is high.
Considering that I have a “real” job in which I should spend more time than in my passion, I wrote a mail to Alyson Bronnenberg asking her whether she would be willing to ship oxbows overseas, AFTER getting the money for them. But up to now I didn’t get an answer. Perhaps she thought my mail was a spam…….
Then I read at Tiller’s (I read much and much about neck yokes, oxbows aso. last time) http://www.tillersinternational.org/oxen/resources_techguides/ImprovingOxYokesTechGuide.pdf
that they improved ox yokes with a dropped hitchpoint aso.
A picture of an improved ox yoke in areas where bendable wood can not be found you can see at the last page. They use round staves instead of bows.
Because I have round wooden staves enough in my workshop I considered this a solution for me. Tomorrow I will test it with hauling out a waggon of manure.
Where do you see the drawbacks of staves to bows ?
Would like to get many answers. (one shortfall is that I need for every stave a pin, but if this is the worst drawback I can live with it.:) )

Thanks
Wolfgang

P.S. How can I delete pics in this forum ?
In the past I attached some pics with a big size and it seems that my account of pics is limited at 10 MB. I would prefer to attach more but smaller pics in this forum because my account is nearly “filled”.

[Rod]

@fabian 24825 wrote:

Up to this time I use unpeeled rattan as stuff for my bows. I’m medium satisfied with them. I can haul out the two axled waggon with manure with the cow team, but I think that I can not use the whole power of the team without the risk of bending the bows.
Then I tried to bend wooden bows from white ash. Ihave a professionel steamtube, which not only produces steam but also pressure. After some more or less successless attempts the last bending worked satisfying. But bending is it not alone. The effort after bending is high.
Considering that I have a “real” job in which I should spend more time than in my passion, I wrote a mail to Alyson Bronnenberg asking her whether she would be willing to ship oxbows overseas, AFTER getting the money for them. But up to now I didn’t get an answer. Perhaps she thought my mail was a spam…….
Then I read at Tiller’s (I read much and much about neck yokes, oxbows aso. last time) http://www.tillersinternational.org/oxen/resources_techguides/ImprovingOxYokesTechGuide.pdf
that they improved ox yokes with a dropped hitchpoint aso.
A picture of an improved ox yoke in areas where bendable wood can not be found you can see at the last page. The use round staves instead of bows.
Because I have round wooden staves enough in my workshop I considered this a solution for me. Tomorrow I will test it with hauling out a waggon of manure.
Where do you see the drawbacks of staves to bows ?
Would like to get many answers. (one shortfall is that I need for every stave a pin, but if this is the worst drawback I can live with it.:) )

Thanks
Wolfgang

P.S. How can I delete pics in this forum ?
In the past I attached some pics with a big size and it seems that my account of pics is limited at 10 MB. I would prefer to attach more but smaller pics in this forum because my account is nearly “filled”.

The staves must be a lot easier to yoke up with. How about replacing the cords on the bottom with a hinged wood piece that would fasten to the opposite stave with a pin?

[fabian]

My idea is to leave the inside stave in the yoke and then put the outside stave under the neck of the ox into the hole and fix it with the pin.
will see tomorrow how it works.
should perhaps take some pics of it.

Wolfgang

[mother katherine]

I don’t know when you tried to contact Alyson, but she just had a baby in January. I suppose she’ll be back to work now. Try her again.
If you’ve contacted Tillers, ask them about using PVC pipe. For some of the smaller yokes we’ve done that. Apparently, Tillers is using a heavy duty PVC to make bows in some of the African countries where they are training teamsters.
oxnun

[Vicki]

Hello fabian. Can you bend PVC bows? It is simple by heating the PVC after filling with sand, either over fire or I’ve used a paint-stripping heat gun. Then fashion dowels to fit in the vertical sides of the PVC bows. The dowel reinforces the PVC well on the sides where some of the draft pressure is absorbed from most of it on the neck seat, while the bow at the bottom holds the bow in place in the traditional manner.

We used this design in Uganda. Others here in the USA have used this too. Maybe someone can testify to the long-term effectiveness of this design?

Hickory and ash ox bows are made by Clark’s Bending–Amish craftsmen–of Baltic, Ohio. They may very well ship to you. Then build your yoke around the bows. Many yoke makers here in the states use Clark’s bows because it is simpler than making your own with a steamer and jig.

It’s good to hear you working those cattle and always thinking of design, applications, etc.

[fabian]

@mother katherine 24830 wrote:

I don’t know when you tried to contact Alyson, but she just had a baby in January.

It was in January ! 🙂

[clayfoot-sandyman]

Fabian,

I got some equipment sent over from Alyson at New England Ox Supply to the UK, she was really helpful although it took us weeks to sort how to do the payment electronically – amazing that in the ‘digital age’ it still seemed to easier to just put some cash in an envelope and send it!
I warn you now, shipping plus import duty adds a lot onto the final bill – BUT there’s not many, if any craftsmen producing ox bows commerially in Europe (she buys them from an Amish chap apparently)…..try again with Alyson, she probably just missed your e-mail.:cool:

Ed

[Nat(wasIxy)]

My stepdad is a wood craftsguy, he can steam and bend things – if anybody could give him exact dimensions etc I’m sure he could do this? He’s up for carving a yoke for me one day so I’m sure the extra business would be welcome?

[fabian]

I got an answer by Alyson yesterday

@clayfoot-sandyman 25028 wrote:

Fabian,

I warn you now, shipping plus import duty adds a lot onto the final bill –

I know. I researched yesterday in the net. Until the bows would be here they will cost so much, that it will be profitable to make them myself.
As you can see above: I’m able to do it ! but it’s a lot of work.

@clayfoot-sandyman 25028 wrote:

BUT there’s not many, if any craftsmen producing ox bows commerially in Europe

May be that I should become one of them ! 😉

@Ixy 25040 wrote:

My stepdad is a wood craftsguy, he can steam and bend things – if anybody could give him exact dimensions etc I’m sure he could do this? He’s up for carving a yoke for me one day so I’m sure the extra business would be welcome?

As I said: I can bend wood and I will do so one day. Until then I will still use my Rattan bows. They work as I could see this mornig again. The dumpcart was full of manure (about 1200 lbs. without the weight of the cart) and I hauled it out with the mixed team (steer/Xcow) for the first time. I think that I would not expect of my team to pull more than the load they had on monday on the two axled waggon or today on the dumpcart.
on the waggon it is a load of about 1500 lbs.

[Nat(wasIxy)]

Well I checked with my stepdad just now and he says he’s perfectly happy to do this for the european people 🙂

[fabian]

@Ixy 25043 wrote:

Well I checked with my stepdad just now and he says he’s perfectly happy to do this for the european people 🙂

Then he should make an offer 😉

[Nat(wasIxy)]

if people know what sort of wood they want and what size they need – feel free to contact….Obviously neither of us know much about yokes, so you need a clear idea of what you want! Likewise yokes. pricing would depend on what you want, we’d have to give you a quote.

I have a tame harness maker and if stepdad can copy my wooden hames, we’ll be able to provide 3pad harnesses too 🙂

[fabian]

@Ixy 25050 wrote:

I have a tame harness maker and if stepdad can copy my wooden hames, we’ll be able to provide 3pad harnesses too 🙂

3pad harness ????

NEVER !!! 😀

[Nat(wasIxy)]

Not asking you to – but I know there’s others in europe looking.

[Author]

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