Favorite draft breeds?

[J-L]

I saw the pictures of your Raven mare Gulo, and I think she is a good looking horse. I would wager she’s got plenty of power.

[Gulo]

Hi J-L…

Thanks, yes she’s quite something. Well over a ton and likes to pit her strength against things. She’s smart and even quite emotional – very easy to read her moods, including how proud she feels when she knows she’s done a good job. She can get pushy occasionally, but show any level of dominance and she backs right down instantly, it’s almost humorous – a big sweetheart’s what she is. She’s our only cross (sire was an enormous black Clydesdale, dam an equally big Percheron), and there’s a story in that. She was sold to me as a “registerable pure Clydesdale.” The fellow said he had the papers but just hadn’t done so yet. So i enquired after them, not cos i cared much, but because i thought potential buyers of her offspring might. He kept stalling on producing them. As time went on – months – and she kept filling out and filling out i realized the only Cydes i could find that really resembled her were in pictures from way back, like 1920’s. Finally, the seller told me he couldn’t find the papers but gave me the registration numbers of her sire and dam which he claimed to have written down. I inquired after these numbers and found they were actually the numbers of Belgian horses! He must’ve just pulled them out of a book and figured i’d go away. Well, i eventually tracked down her breeder, and he remembered her right away and told me the true story – she was an accidental breeding on his farm.

I don’t know why a fellow would go to those lengths. I’d have bought her anyway, she’s amazing. A bit big, if truth be told, and i prefer the pure Clyde conformation, but she’s a great horse anyway. Horse traders!

[simon lenihan]

IT is true that from time to time that a large ardenner would be rejistered in the brabant stud book and visa versa. It is wrong to say that the ardenner originated from the brabant it is the other way around, the original ardennes was more like a heavy draft pony, julius cesar wrote about the ardennes in which he said they posessed great stamina and were very couragous, napolean used them as his artillery horses and they gained alot of respect in that they were the only breed that made it back from his ill faithed siege on moscow. It was only when the ardenners were moved to the more fertile lowlands of belgium and holland that we see the start of the larger more cumbersome brabant/ flemish, these horses were used by the knights at the time as they were able to carry all that heavy armour. It was during the middle to late 1800 that we see the various stud books being set up, the ardennenes region is a very hilly rugged region that seperates belgium and france and the farms here at that time would have been worked with ardenner horses as firstly, the brabant would be too big and cumbersome for such steep gradients and secondly the farmers of the time would not have been able to feed such a large horse as times were tough and the horses that they kept had to be economical to keep [ the ardennes to this day are easy keepers ]. History tells us that what made the ardennes horse even better was the infusion of arabian blood during the early part of the 1800s this gave the horse more stamina, this is something that is still been practiced today. In 1870 ardenner stallions were imported to sweden by the government of the time to cross with the local north swedish horse the resulting offspring were said to be remarkable little horses of great power and endurance, however approx 15 years later brabants were imported as they required a heavier horse to pull the now heavier farm machinery and thus alot of the original blood lines were lost. Today we have the belgium ardenner the french ardenner and the swedish ardenner all originated from the smaller horse i described but as we know there was crossing with the brabant / flemish in all three depending on what was required at the time. We keep what can be described as the old original type, my horses range from 14.2 to 15.1 hh but there will be brabant blood in there somewhere, we are always on the look out for the old fashioned type to cross to our own to try and get back to what alot of writers claim was one of the best horses in the world.
simon lenihan

[Carl Russell]

Thanks Simon, that is an excellent lesson. Carl

[jen judkins]

Which version is most common in the USA or are our belgians a third variation of the breed? I have a neighbor who claims his belgian is european brabant…he is indeed big and roan in color, which stands out in comparison to the common belgian I see most. The history is fascinating…thanks Simon. Jennifer.

[Gulo]

As i understand it Jennifer the “American Belgian” evolved on this continent from original Brabant-like stock. I was looking through Grant MacEwan’s book on the history of the heavy horse in Canada, and some of the pictures of the foundation belgian stallions in the early years of the past century included squat, roan horses with black-feathered legs and feet – Brabants!

Another bit of heavy horse history many may not know is that the Shire and the Clydesdale were interbred at will, when traits were desired on either side, up until the 1970’s when the books were separated.

[PestoPower]

In case you hadn’t guessed I’m a Belgian person. I have had quite a few now- including the four that just came in from New Holland.

They can be moosey and stuborn, but I like their tractability and they are easy to train.

I agree with the “hitch type” ruining the farm type horse. I don’t need a 19h light boned tall Belgian that can pick its knees up to his ears. Upheaded makes it tough to collar :p, heck they may even hit that big old head on low limbs 😉

JMO
B

[Plowboy]

Gulo, An old timer said to me once, ” You know what the difference between a Shire and a Clydesdale is don’t you?” . “No what is it?” …………” Nothin”. As he chuckled and walked away. Any Privately owned Clydes and Shires I have seen around here I don’t even stop to look at poor feet, bad pasterns etc. The budweiser Clydesdales were here last fall and I would have to say they were pretty nice. Good feet and legs deep bodied and well kept. They were probably the nicest Clydes I had seen until you posted your pictures on the photo page. You my friend have some nice looking horses.

[Plowboy]

I was just reading back to some earlier posts about Brabants and American Belgians. I read some years back that as hores were on the down hill slide as tractors moved in the Belgian was brought in as then what was a Brabant. It was thought to be the perfect farming horse. It never took off until horses rebounded as a hobby in the 70’s and 80’s. Back in the day the Percheron and crosses of which farmed the land of this country for the most part. Some die hard Belgian breeders took the Brabant and decided he should be sorrel, have less feather, and longer legs creating the American Belgian of today and some poor feet issues in the 80’s which seem to be improving. A mentor of mine Don Hibbard of West Winfield ,N.Y. who is 88 I believe and stands less than 5 ft tall was a long time Belgian breeder. When it got to be that he couldn’t find a stud under 16 hands he got fed up. Somehow he heard of Anne and Henry Harper and bought some Brabants and still to this day owns 5 of there descendants. I actually met Anne at the NYS Draft Sale in Cortland about a year and a half ago, nice lady.

[Git-Up-Doc]

This may sound a little repetitive but I too am a fan of the Brabant and Ardennais. I just love their colour and how stocky and thick they are. I currently have a Belgian but some day I would love to have a team of Brabant or Ardennais horses.

[416Jonny]

You know what’s a great horse? Belgian/Percheron crosses. I think they look a lot like some of the older draft breeds.

Although there is this lady up the road that bought one of the Myer’s Shire offspring that I would love to have. He’s a 4 year old that has had some serious training. It didn’t come out untill I took control over the lady that was letting this enormous creature walk all over her. Picks his feet up perfect, doesn’t have a hateful bone in his body. What a sweet boy. Can’t wait for his owner to get sick of him.

Better just bide my time. Maybe this economic down turn is a perfect opportunity……

Jonny B.

[Plowboy]

Belgian/Percheron crosses are great horses and I would love to have a nice team of 16 hand chunky bays. My biggest problem is we have 5 Percheron mares and I just couldn’t bring myself to breed them to a Belgian stud on purpose. I guess I’m stuck with the blacks and greys unless I buy some bays someday. We still have a couple drafty percheron stallions around locally and a bulldog looking 16 hand spotted draft. If we can’t save our farm style Percherons we’ll have to look into Suffolks in the future.

[Does’ Leap]

We purchased our team of Belgian / Perch crosses a little of a year ago. Being new to the horse world, I had never seen a bay draft horse. Needless to say they top my list of favorite breeds. Here is an attachment of one of the two half brothers we bought. They were 5 when we bought them and stand 16.2.

George

[simon lenihan]

george,
a friend in bc canada has a team similar in colour and the same cross and reckons them to be the best team he has ever owned, hybred vigour seems to have the advantage over pure breds in recent years. This was not always the case, seems they are few folk breeding proper working stock now.
simon lenihan

[J-L]

Reading Plowboys post reminds me of my all time favorite work horse. His name was Doc and I worked him for about ten years when I got out of the service. He was coal black, not a white hair anywhere, and about 15 and a half hands. I would guess he worked down to about1500 or 1600 pounds and wore a 24″ collar. He was a working fool and had loads of common sense. I often wished he was a stud. I haven’t seen his like around this part of the country since.
After him came a couple teams of some what forgettable Belgians and now some mules. I do like the mules as far as being efficient work animals, but I sure miss old Doc.

[Author]

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