Favorite draft breeds?

[bivol]

posavian horse, definitly. they are powerful, hardy, easy to maintain, can be outside all year round, and have calm tempers.

[Jean]

@bivol 4640 wrote:

posavian horse, definitly. they are powerful, hardy, easy to maintain, can be outside all year round, and have calm tempers./QUOTE]

Not to mention stunning to look at!

[Robert MoonShadow]

Posavians… never heard of them; but it looks like raw power!!

[bivol]

glad you are intrested!

they are from croatia, where i live. they are known to have calm and loving natures. historically they were, and are, kept in flooded pasture and have learned to graze under water. they just close their nose and submerge the head! they can stay on pastures all year. in case of a storm they group heads in and hind end out. AND they can withstand dog and wolf attacks!

although they are primarilly used as a draft breed in the plains they are actually a vertisale breed, used to pack wood out of steep terrain in mountainous areas.

[IMG]

….and are good at it!

i read a story a string of pack horses (not sure if it were posavians though, could have also been the tough and sure footed bosnian mountain horses) carried out such loads as seen down along an 80% steep woodland and none of the horses tripped. no need for mules here!

they sure can take a load. anyway, every trunk is every bit as heavy as it looks, i’ve lifted them back when we had wood heating.
anyway the job of packing the wood out of inaccesable areas is considered (by people who did both) to be the hardest and most dangerous after mining. we are talking about mining in bosnia, balkans, though…

if you are intrested in more of the indigenous balkanian horse breeds i’ll be glad to post what i know!:D

[Robert MoonShadow]

How about a thumbnail description of them? –> Height, weight, color, temperaments, etc.? I’d be interested in knowing about the various breeds.

[jen judkins]

I wonder if anyone in the US uses the pack horse the way they are used in Croatia. I noted that in this thread and in the amazing video Bivol posted yesterday, that the horses are loaded up with wood in this fashion…quite intriguing in its design, really. Has anyone seen this used logging in the US? What type of horse would you use for it? The horses in the pictures and the video appear very compact…good bone, but not all that tall. Would this be a good job for a fjord or a halflinger? Jennifer.

[Robert MoonShadow]

Jennifer ~ I don’t know about packing firewood, but we use metal frames on our pack saddles to haul lumber into the wildernesses when building bridges, etc. We call them, um… ‘board-packers’ :rolleyes:
Our 2 mules (one’s a standard-sized, the other’s a Belgian mule) pack all kind of weird stuff in… I’m sure they’d haul firewood logs, but not much need to out west, here. The Belgian mule’s really too big to pack, but she sure comes in handy for pulling the trailace & stumps, etc.!!
Hhmmm… those Fjord mules (Fjules), now….

[bivol]

hi!

before i start addressing the horse fact sheet i would like to say a few words about the envorment in which these horses lived. balkan region is mountainous, often not so fertile, except the valleys.

the posavian horse is a result of introducing arabian (less) and draft horse blood to indigenous population of horse inhabiting the alluvial plain of sava river.
the posavian today can still live on the pasture, and this type of keeping stops it from growing too big.

the horses upon whom the improvement were started did not belong a distinct breed, and had various local types.

the indigenous horse came to by crossing horses available from the bronze and iron age with steppe horses of the the conquering peoples.
as a rule, they were small, tough, enduring, could live on maegre rations all the time. they were weather resistant. they were used for packing riding army service and were to the common people the only type of horse available.

anyway, the posavian is now a different breed than the bosnian pony or mountain horse. the latter is smaller and with more arabic blood in them, and as a general rule foremost a pack horse.

posavian

14 hh

about 450 kilos

calm and obedient temperament, but hard workers.

[Gulo]

@Plowboy 4384 wrote:

Gulo, An old timer said to me once, ” You know what the difference between a Shire and a Clydesdale is don’t you?” . “No what is it?” …………” Nothin”. As he chuckled and walked away. Any Privately owned Clydes and Shires I have seen around here I don’t even stop to look at poor feet, bad pasterns etc. The budweiser Clydesdales were here last fall and I would have to say they were pretty nice. Good feet and legs deep bodied and well kept. They were probably the nicest Clydes I had seen until you posted your pictures on the photo page. You my friend have some nice looking horses.

Thanks very much, Plowboy! I’ve seen some bad clydes too (many of the blacks i’ve seen are not very well put together, being bred primarily for colour.) I’m happy to say ours are very beautiful, sound, nice tempered and good working conformation (granting that a clyde is supposed to be a little lighter than a pure farmhorse in order to be good for more tasks, like roadwork). They’re more like old-school clydes – not too tall, still lots of substance. We were lucky to find a breeder who was not a showman. Apparently Canada, at least historically, had better Clydes than the U.S. And the roan individuals, which are not “in fashion”, are often the best examples of the breed for conformation and other aspects of quality of all. I personally like the roans best of all aesthetically, too. But you’ll never see a roan Clyde stallion, as far as I know! They geld ’em all. Maybe i’ll be the first to keep one intact and breed it.

I had an English shire/clyde show judge who said he used to not know which was which until he saw the papers, but now they’re a little more divergent. I personally think the clydes are more aesthetic and move more gracefully (for whatever that’s worth – which isn’t much pulling a plow, i guess!), and tend to have proportionately larger feet.

Bivol – that’s a great looking horse in that pic! Reinforces my belief as i’ve said in other threads that overall Europe must be a much better place for finding great, old-school draft horses than North America.

I’ll also add that if I were looking for a smaller draft, i’d definately give the Dales Pony a try – if i could find one!

[Farmerdude]

Does anyone have any experience or thoughts on using the old foundation Quarter Horse as an all-purpose farm horse? 15.2-16 hh, 1300-1400 lbs riding, driving, work team?

[Donn Hewes]

I hope you find someone who has done it, all though I doubt there are many. I have seen a few saddle horses that I say, “man, I would love to have a pair of those on a mower”. Find the right combo of level headed and stocky and it should work good. Hard to find 1400# perhaps. Donn

[manesntails]

Hey Farmerdude, My Quarter Horse would much rather chase cows. I suppose it could be done but 1300-1400lb QH’s aren’t common. Mines 15h and 1200 but he’s fat. Work him hard and he’s be down to 1000 in no time.

I like Percherons. I would like to have a nice pair of Percheron Molly mules for work. You can’t beat the bone on those old style Percheron pulling horses. My old Percheron rescue mare has legs as big as my thighs. I know she pulled a ton when she was younger, she has the harness and collar scars to prove it.

[dominiquer60]

It was my impression that foundation lines were more in the 14h to 15.2h 1,000+ pound range, and that QHs of real height are heavily influenced by Thoroughbreds being introduced a while back. This has just been my experience with the breed. I am sure that you could use a team for farm work just not in the capacity that a heavy team can handle. 100 years ago not everyone could afford a heavy team so they made due with what was available. Neil Perry does all his farm work with his Morgans, he just uses more of them to do the same job that a 2 ton team can. Given the QH is about as versatile and trainable as the Morgan horse, I can’t see why they wouldn’t work.

The only difference that I see besides size is that QHs have a higher percentage of fast twitch vs. slow twitch muscle compared to your common coldblooded work horse. Fast twitch delivers a high amount of energy for a short period of time, such as the 1/4 mile sprint, and slow twitch provides for less energy over a more drawn out usage like toiling in the hay field all day. The QH may need to be conditioned a little differently to get used to farm work, and I would caution you about using a HYPP positive QH. I can’t remember all the details of this genetic disease, but my gut feeling is that they would not make good work animals.

Erika

[manesntails]

@dominiquer60 5171 wrote:

I would caution you about using a HYPP positive QH. I can’t remember all the details of this genetic disease, but my gut feeling is that they would not make good work animals.

Erika

The Stallion “Impressive” is the horse that introduced this disease to the QH lines. He was a racing QH and there are a gazillion horses out there who decend from him. Every registered QH with Impressive in his background has to be tested for HYPP. They can inherit none of the disease and be HYPP/NN like my QH is. This means both parents are N “negative” for the disease. If they are HYPP/NH they are carring the disease and may or may not get symptoms.

The symptoms are horrendous and the horse usually starts off with unnoticed small convulsions. I’m not up on all the details of what can happen after that except that the disease is a death sentence. It the horse is HYPP/HH he should be put down as he has genes for the disease from both parents. These foals usually die shortly after birth but some live on to mature and then suddenly die.

Whenever you buy a QH that is registered with Impressive lineage, it will have a HYPP rating on the papers. Myself, I would not buy a QH that was not registered as these horses MAY be culled HYPP/NH horses.

[becorson]

HYPP is an inherited metabolic disease. HYPP horses have trouble regulating the level of potassium in their muscle cells. since the level of potassium inside the diaphragm and heart muscle cells is what keeps us alive, it’s a serious problem. MIld cases can often be managed with low potassium diets but it’s by no means fool proof. so i wouldn’t get a purebred quarterhorse unless i knew he was HYPP negative. there are other muscle-related metabolic diseases that affect Quarter horses, too.

draft horses have their own versions of inherited metabolic problems. Veterinary pathologist Dr. Beth Valentine is an expert on this subject and she is also a draft-horse owner. if you want to know more about inherited metabolic / muscle diseases of horses she is a good source for information. she has written a book for horse owners and also contributes to RUral Heritage (magazine and web site).

[Author]

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