"Horse People"

[Hal]

I was recently reading Lynn Miller’s “Training Workhorses” when I came across a quote in which the author said that “some people are not suited to work horses” because of their personality. I have heard from others that some people just aren’t suited for horse work and cannot get comfortable with it.

I feel that there is a belief that some people are born “horse people” and others are simply not. Have any of you encountered this idea or people who showed it to be true (ie, people who seemed totally inept with horses despite trying to get training)?

I am not necessarily disputing the idea, but I don’t really understand how that could be the case.

[sanhestar]

I believe that there are people that are inept with animals in general.

f.e. people that lack f.e. empathy for an animals state of mind, that tend to humanise an animal (that is often the case with dog or cat owners), that can’t learn to registrate body language or can’t relate to body signals given from the animal.

People that have their head not in the game, no matter, how much you tell them to.

My hubby was and still is to some extend this type of person. He loves animals and loves to be around them but he can’t “read” them well enough, fast enough, accurate enough. For him it’s ok with the goats and to some extend with the dogs but he was at a total loss with the horses. They would pick up on his absentmindedness and took advantage of him.

And then there are people who simply are cruel to animals and can’t overcome this or are unwilling to learn other ways of treating animals. Or are afraid of large animals (like horses) and can’t shake this fear like a friend of mine. People that are very insecure – they will show this insecurity in their body language.

[Rob FLory]

Hi,
I’ve taught driving oxen to over a hundred people and driving horses to a handful. There are some who get it(driving oxen or horses) very easily, and others that seem like they may never. In between, I am sure, are a whole bunch of folks who will get it, but have to work harder at it. I think I was one of those.

Rob

[Robert MoonShadow]

Hal ~ I have the same book – and am reading it now, also. My impression of what he meant in that text was more about a person’s temperament – for example, farmers that are totally goal-focused as opposed to those that are process-oriented. Get the field plowed in the fastest, most efficient manner (large tractor) or get as much work done while enjoying the process & manner in which it’s done. He points out that such a goal-oriented person can become fixated on the end results; that type of person would find it hard to adapt to the slower pace of working with animals. Which can lead to impatience… then frustration… and both the farmer & the animals having negative experiences from it.
Just my take on what he’s referring to.

[Rod]

I think some people are Ox people and others more inclined to the horses. I am still trying to figure out what I am.:confused:

[Carl Russell]

I have been told that there are “horse people, cattle people, or mule people”, but rarely a mix. I tend to dispute that, as I am one who tend to gravitate toward all animals for their presence, and straight forwardness.

However, as I am asked by many people who are considering draft animals, does this species make sense, or that one?, I tend to lean toward an intuitive gravitation. In other words, if you are attracted to being around cattle, then try them, or horses, or mules, or whatever. Don’t follow someone else’s direction to over ride your own intuition.

On the broader discussion, I totally agree that there are people who are so indoctrinated into a modern mechanized approach that they have a very hard time understanding how to incorporate animal power. Although there are time, skill, and financial constraints that can justify mixed power systems, animal power really shines when the physical limitations are fully embraced and a process is simplified. I tend to be invigorated by physical activity, and find that I can relate to the use of animal power quite easily, which is quite difficult from the seat of a tractor.

Carl

[Hal]

Very interesting posts, everyone. In response to sanhester’s suggestion that people who “tend to humanise” animals are more often inept around animals, I find it difficult to think of a person who works well with animals who does not have at least a bit of a tendency to humanize them. Even giving an animal a name is, in a sense, a form of humanizing it. Of course, I understand that you probably should not treat a working animal like a pet (or maybe I am wrong?).

In addition, these posts concern me a bit. Do you (forum members in general) think that working well with draft with animals is a rare skill? It worries me to think that I might find myself one of these inept people when I start to work with horses at my upcoming internship.

[OldKat]

@Robert MoonShadow 6635 wrote:

Hal ~ I have the same book – and am reading it now, also. My impression of what he meant in that text was more about a person’s temperament – for example, farmers that are totally goal-focused as opposed to those that are process-oriented. Get the field plowed in the fastest, most efficient manner (large tractor) or get as much work done while enjoying the process & manner in which it’s done. He points out that such a goal-oriented person can become fixated on the end results; that type of person would find it hard to adapt to the slower pace of working with animals. Which can lead to impatience… then frustration… and both the farmer & the animals having negative experiences from it.
Just my take on what he’s referring to.

… in all of these posts. Robert’s in particular brings to mind something that someone told me several years ago. When I first decided to start up with work horses I decided to go take a 3 & 1/2 day short course on driving that was being offered by a very qualified instructor, as I hadn’t done any driving at all in about 15 years and very little since I was about 15 or 16 years old (which was about, ohhh, ahhh, never mind how long ago THAT was!)

Anyway, about the second day of the course (I happened to be the only one that signed up for that session, so I got some in-depth attention) the instructor started chuckling while I was driving. I thought I must be screwing up badly, so I asked “Well what am I doing wrong?” He said, “Oh nothing, I was just thinking that you have better “hands” than the guy that owns this farm and I have been working with him for over 2 years”. I asked what the owners problem seemed to be and he said “Well, he has absolutely no touch with the lines, every thing he does is very heavy handed” Then he said “You know some people just can’t get it. They have no feel for this”

That sure made me feel good, but I felt bad for the guy that had made such an investment in the horses, equipment, land, barns etc. I asked the instructor, “What does he do for a living?” I won’t say what it was that the guy did, but his next comment was pretty telling. He said “I guess his world is all about high pressure and tension & doing deals. He just can’t seem to get it through his head that the horses don’t respond all that well to that way of doing things” Sure seems to fit with what Robert is saying.

[Carl Russell]

Hal;6640 wrote:

… I find it difficult to think of a person who works well with animals who does not have at least a bit of a tendency to humanize them. Even giving an animal a name is, in a sense, a form of humanizing it. ….

Do you (forum members in general) think that working well with draft with animals is a rare skill? It worries me to think that I might find myself one of these inept people when I start to work with horses at my upcoming internship.

The name is, or should be a command to alert that animal that you are speaking to it. It does not describe “who” it is.

To effectively work with animals you need to understand them as the animal that they are, and that is not “human”. This means get out of your head, and try to relate to the animal on their terms. They cannot “speak human”, so you have to learn their language.

Hal, your concern is a good indication of your sensitivity, which is a big step in the right direction.

That sure made me feel good, but I felt bad for the guy that had made such an investment in the horses, equipment, land, barns etc.

Old Kat, this unfortunately is a big problem, many many people impulsively buy into this dream, and even though they could possibly develop the skills, they are so dependent on their ability to spend money to solve their problems that they are handicapped when it comes time to invest themselves in learning the skills.

Carl

[SidehillnDirtpoor]

my grandfather’s (b 1903 & 1907) loved working horses. My father’s father, was almost helpless with a tractor, and god forbid if you got to ride with him in a auto……….. My father hated horse’s but loved the cows. Horses didn’t like being around him much either. he trucked cattle and horses for a living for the better part of 30 yrs in NY.

I remember reading that the introduction of tractors to the farms……..
Was the best thing that happened for horses…………..
Those people that enjoyed them and worked well with them, Kept them, Those that had No Buisness with horses got their wish and got rid of them…

As my father would say (insert teamster for truck driver)
There’s Truck drivers………………………
And then theres just Drivers of Trucks………….. (Steering wheel holders)

[OldKat]

@Carl Russell 6643 wrote:

The name is, or should be a command to alert that animal that you are speaking to it. It does not describe “who” it is.

To effectively work with animals you need to understand them as the animal that they are, and that is not “human”. This means get out of your head, and try to relate to the animal on their terms. They cannot “speak human”, so you have to learn their language.

Hal, your concern is a good indication of your sensitivity, which is a big step in the right direction.

Old Kat, this unfortunately is a big problem, many many people impulsively buy into this dream, and even though they could possibly develop the skills, they are so dependent on their ability to spend money to solve their problems that they are handicapped when it comes time to invest themselves in learning the skills.

Carl

One thing I forgot to mention, but your comments nail this home, too, is that I asked the instructor (who was also the farm manager) why did the owner even get into this & how did he happen to choose Clydesdales as his chosen breed?

His answer was very telling; he said “Well he likes Budweiser …” Whenever I meet someone with Clyde’s I usually ask “How did you come to choose Clydesdales?” Almost invariably they say something about Budweiser. I am sure that there are plenty of folks out there that this does not apply to, but it is not exactly the greatest reason to choose to own a certain breed of animal.

[Git-Up-Doc]

I think there’s Ford people, Dodge people, and Chev people.

Actually I think some people just aren’t animal people. A lot of people who are fast moving and excitable are just not good around animals. My counsin would always make my doberman pee on the floor when she came over just because she would get her all wound up (herself too). But theres people I know who are very quite and calm and the animals literally flock to them.

[jen judkins]

OK, I found a good example of people who are hopeless with animals. As you will see they love animals, but just don’t seem to ‘get’ them…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWd_r2sOPhs

[Simple Living]

Jen.
I think you just found a video of 75% of the women out there that always wanted a “my pretty pony” as a child. Reminds me of a few people I know as well. Thanks for the belly laugh, I needed that today!

Gordon

[Gabe Ayers]

You are mistaken Humble1, those people were/are from Tennessee. Virginia was never mentioned in the show….???

There is a long thread on here (DAP) about this from when it first hit the air waves. I agree, not great horsemanship or mule skinning or animal husbandry.

Some folks in that previous thread pointed out that they were doing the best they knew how and just trying to feed their families.

I am not sure where the thread is at on this site, but it is here somewhere, you may enjoy reading it.

Just found it at:

Extreme Logging = Sensationalism under Books/Resources

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