Training Them Old School

[mitchmaine]

hey geoff,
have you floated his teeth lately? he might have an eruption back there where you can’t see and your girl might have struck a nerve on the horse accidentally. don’t know, just a thought but i’d look there first.

[jac]

Definaitly second Mitch on that one Geoff..
John

[Andy Carson]

I have used a trail riding bridle with a detachable bit on my mare before. She doesn’t like the bit being fixed on one side and swung across (through) her mouth and feels much more comfortable with a “straight in” kind of motion. It not a big deal to me, so I make sure I put the bit in straight each time and don’t “swing it” across. I just have to detach both clips to do this instead of just one. My wifes horse has been touchy about taking his bit in the past. We tried some apple-favored wipes to get him to take the bit easier (which worked fantastically) and eventually switched over to a bit with a copper center (the center of the french link). As long as the bit is not really cold, he takes it right up without any apple favored wipe futzing. I guess it was the taste he objected to, but there are many ways to “skin that cat”… Some other ideas to try at least, but I would check the teeth too.

[grey]

Geoff,

Bummed I couldn’t make it to Wilson Creek… our antique housecat had to go to the vet.

How often does someone else harness or bit up your team?

[near horse]

Thanks for the replys. I too thought about the teeth issue as well as an overall sore mouth. The sore mouth isn’t likely as he’ll let me fiddle with his lips and put my fingers in on the bars of his mouth unless he thinks it’s preparing for the bit to be inserted. Then he gets owly. I tried to palpate his jaw from the outside and didn’t get any response but that probably doesn’t mean much. Probably need to have the teeth checked.

Jenny, I don’t usually let someone else harness or bridle my horses but I wrongly assumed my team was calm enough to handle it. Too bad you couldn’t make it to Wilson Creek as I’m pretty sure that was the last one they’re going to have there.

[grey]

It’s okay, your horse just had a little setback. Horses don’t automatically trust all humans, just because they have come to an agreement with one particular fellow (you). If a team is going to be used by another teamster, the team needs to negotiate separately with that person. Different teams have different requirements of a teamster. Sounds like your team has very particular criteria and negotiations did not result favorably for that other person.

I have a horse that anyone with a modicum of skill can drive. I let others halter her, harness her, ground drive her, ride her, lead her, undress her. She’s a good and patient teacher. However, I do not let anyone else put her collar on or bridle her. She and I have come to an understanding about this and I’m okay with it. If I had a lot of students coming through it might be different. But the way things stand now, it’s just better if I do it

What did you do to resolve his bridling problem the first time?

[Carl Russell]

One trick I have used to get a horse to take the bit is peppermint candies. I hold the peppermint in the hand with the bit, and they have to take the bit to get the candy. I only bit straight in, attached to the bridle, just because I never have had a detachable bit.

Carl

[near horse]

The suddenness of this behavior makes me think that there might be a larger issue here (teeth for example).

Jenny, bitting was never a serious problem just had the potential to be one. Ranger (the horse) would take the bit but would throw his head a couple of times before letting me do it. So I just slowed the whole process down, put my thumb in gently on the bar of one side of his mouth and then slide in the bit. Now, he recognizes that my thumb on his bar means here comes da bit.

Right now we’re trying to reestablish our “relationship” (that sounds weird) but he seems fine in most other behaviors – let’s me halter him, drops his head, can even put the bridle on and buckle throat latch. It’s just when the bit part happens that he’s bad.

See what tomorrow brings.

[grey]

If the onset of this problem was literally between one bridling and the next, with a different handler in between, I’d suspect he’s pulling one over on you. Somehow I had it in my mind that he had given you trouble over bitting or bridling once upon a time, a while back.

Has he had his wolf teeth removed while in your ownership? If not, have you checked for them?

I guess if it were my horse, I’d put his halter on and work with him like that for a while. First get him to drop his head and take the halter on and off a few times. Then stick your fingers in the corners of his mouth, reach past the bars and fiddle with his tongue. Get him to open his mouth and try to evict you. No bit, no bridle. Just play with his mouth. Look at his teeth, feel around on his tongue, stuff like that.

After he’d gotten soft about my fussing with his mouth, then I’d put his bridle on (with no bit) and play with his mouth some more until I could do it without him trying to lift his head to evade. Then maybe if I wasn’t entirely out of patience I’d try putting a rope in his mouth a few times before I tried putting the bit in.

[CharlyBonifaz]

used to wrap/tie neopren around the bit for extremely sensitive horses; is a mouthful but won’t clink against the teeth and keeps them busy with their tongue
also have seen horses ridden with a rope through their mouth (sling through/wrap around both ends of the bridle to steady) so that should at least be possible as an interim way to work him

[Carl Russell]

I’ve experienced this kind of set-back with horses of mine after working with novices. I had a horse that would stand ground-tied wheel away from a wide-eyed beginner.

I have tried to keep those exposures to a minimum, but have also found that when I got anxious about ground that was lost, then I had ground to make up.

Now that I just expect the same behavior from them regardless of the experience, I rarely have any ground to make up.

From the tone of your posts you seem very concerned, or at least confused. If you are telegraphing that to him, he may be concerned and confuse too.

Just a thought.

Of course it makes sense to check out the acute onset of something serious at the same time.

Carl

[Donn Hewes]

Hi Geoff, I agree with Carl’s post about the message we send to the animal we are trying to bridle. For myself I wouldn’t like the detached bit method as it would interrupt the method I already use. When my right hand is between a horses ears and holding the top of the bridle this is signal to lower your head and except a bit and bridle. This way my left hand is free to hold the bit and open the mouth if need be. The right hand can hold the bridle up once the bit is in the mouth.

This signal can easily be taught with a halter or a rope halter by placing a hand or fingers on the poll and applying a little pressure as you add a little pressure from the halter. Release all the pressure as soon as the head starts to move down. Eventually this translates to a head that is lowered for a hand between the ears.

[Author]

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