Wormers?/Alternatives?

[ngcmcn]

Was thinking the other day that i hadn’t wormed my two mares in about a year, and every time i think about doing it I wish there was some way to varify , besides a fecal egg count by the vet, to weather or not my girls even have worms of any type. They are healthy, sound, good coats, good appetites. I guess what i’m looking for is any wisdom to smaller clues that indeed there may be some worms . Also i’d be interested in any ones take on alternative treatments besides supporting the major pharmaceuticals. We also have a small dairy herd and would prefer not to have Ivermectin in the feed stream, though i imagine it breaks down fairly quickly in a compost pile.
Tobacco. I’ve heard about being used as a dewormer.Popple bark??
I’ve heard of horses not being wormed for years, getting sick and had such a heavy worm load, they died in two days.

Any suggestions would be welcome.

Neal McNaughten
Unity, Me.

[Rick Alger]

Hi Neal,

You may know this, but anyway, the Vet can do a fecal sample and tell you if your mares have worms.
Pasture rotation is the only alternative that comes to mind.

[Dave Camire]

Not for certain if it is an old tale or if giving Hemlock boughs in the pasture may be used for deworming/prevention. I have heard of old timers giving tobacco leaves for worms, have also heard of hemlock, is this accurate? Has anyone else heard either positive or negative to either method?

[CIW]

Some folks are using Dietamacious Earth (DE) as a wormer. Its a natural refined subatance.
I understand that it so fine that the worm ingest it and it kills them causing an internal bleeding. Under a microscope it looks like tiny shards of glass.
Their claims are that it doesn’t effect the animal though.
It comes as a powder. Almost like talc. And sprinkled over a feed ration. Probably something like sweet feed would work best so it doesn’t end up in the bottom of the feed pan.
Don’t know the dosing instruction.
Some dairies are starting to use it to help maintain their natural or organic status.

[john plowden]

We use D.E. as well – sprinkled over grain often – has helped , but not eliminated worming – Black walnut hull can be effective –

[Carl Russell]

Neal, All of the treatments above have their supporters, and anecdotal evidence. I guess the basis for your question is treatment with purpose. The microscopic evaluation is not rocket science, and for the investment in an used microscope, you may be able to get some training from a vet, or vet tech. I know folks who graduate from VTC have good practice with this. I have a friend in NH who took it upon herself to learn so that she could do her own (horses) fecal exams, and therefore could mount an effective program that eventually eliminated parasites from her herd. This seems like the most effective and least invasive way to manage parasites. I must say that I have never taken that step, and like you, end up trying to remember the last treatment, which even with a light load, really never addresses the potential problem head on. You might check with a local(???) college/HS that has a vet tech program and volunteer your manure for lab work. Good luck, Carl

[john plowden]

This is actually Mrs. J.P. but- I have read that with adequate amounts of copper in the diet- worms cannot thrive. Kelp is the best supplement providing both vitamins and minerals along with a salt lick the horse should get a balance.
D.E. is a great maintenance for worms but an infestation has gone too far for D.E to rid them- Black walnut hull can be toxic but small amounts are not. It’s always best to err on the cautious side. Google both black walnut hull and wormwood and see what comes up. Also garlic is a great way to keep worms away. I have found that an infestation is best treated with the big guns- then prevention from then on where proper copper is essential.
C.P.

[Crabapple Farm]

We’ve been using an herbal wormer for our sheep from Hoegger’s Goat Supply, while they don’t talk about use in horses, their dosage instructions are by body weight so easy enough to scale up. It doesn’t have any of the real powerful (toxic) stuff like tobacco or walnut hulls, but they claim it bested Ivermectin in a study of reducing worm loads in goats. Not all the same species of worms, but all the ingredients are general vermifuges.
It’s designed for regular (weekly) dosage, and creates an inhospitable environment for worms. It’s a powder that we mix with kelp and they eat it right up. We used it on a calf who we suspected was wormy and he started improving pretty quickly (totally anecdotal as we didn’t get any fecal counts).

We’ve talked a little about planting ourselves a worming garden and drying and mixing our own based on their ingredients but haven’t done that yet.

One possible concern about using “the big guns” is that if there is a heavy worm infestation and they all die and let go at once, there can be some hemorraging – possibly more dangerous than the worms. So that’s one argument in favor of a) prevention and b) gentler wormers.
-Tevis

[john plowden]

I highly recommend a book by Pat Coleby “Natural Horse Care” I know Small Farmers Journal carries her goat and sheep book so they probably have the horse one. She covers all this and in an easy to understand manner
C.P.

[Uncle Mike]

Garlic Barrier is a product that they recommned for deworming and maintaining sheep while maintaining Organic status.

[jen judkins]

@Dave Camire 1197 wrote:

Not for certain if it is an old tale or if giving Hemlock boughs in the pasture may be used for deworming/prevention. I have heard of old timers giving tobacco leaves for worms, have also heard of hemlock, is this accurate? Has anyone else heard either positive or negative to either method?

I wonder if this is why my horses love to chew on my hemlock barn?!:eek:

[sanhestar]

Hello,

hemlock and other trees can help (!) prevent worms but often fail to expel them.

Similar with tobacco and wormwood – they will (!) expel worms but the dosage required is near the toxic dosage for animals, so be careful.

A good source of herbal remedies are also the books from Juliette de Bairacli-Levy “Herbal Handbook for Farm and Stable” and others.

With herbal wormers prevention and management becomes more important (pasture rotation, cleaning, feeders, letting other animals like cows, sheep or goats, graze, too, waiting for the dew to dry in the morning before letting them out to graze) and also knowing how prone to parasite infections an individual animal is (fecal exams).

[Rod]

Pat Colby also has a “Natural Cattle Care ” book that spells out a safe way to get the copper into the cattle and it’s effect on the worms. I also have used Shalklee’s Basic H (liquid soap) in the water tanks. I read that Joe Satalitn (Polyface Farm) has used the Basic H for many years as his only wormer. My cows seem to love the stuff, suds and all.

[Rod44]

Based upon a course in college in Vetinarary Parasitaligy (sp) and my years as a dairy specialist for a large feed company. The worms are not always shedding eggs, which is what you are looking for in the fecal sample. So you may or may not have worms even if you have it tested. For what little it costs to DEworm them, I just do it a couple times a year as a general practice.

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