Tie Stall vs Box Stall

a few thoughts:
certainly being in tie stalls makes for less waste in hay and bedding, so that is a major plus for people who are trying to save money.
i think the mews and stables of the various royal families in Europe traditionally used tie stalls (standing stalls) for their horses in work, (as opposed to their breeding stock) so i don’t think it’s JUST space/ or money .
horses in standing stalls learn to tolerate being handled and tended from behind without being able to turn around, so that might help them as driving horses… ?

on the other hand, researchers say that horses can only experience REM sleep when they are lying down and they can’t lie down, flat on their sides, in a standing stall.

An ideal situation might be horses in standing stalls part of the day, and turned out part of the day, too.

Donn ~ Did you design your barn this way, or did you ‘inherit’ it (came this way)? It sounds very functional.

@highway 5792 wrote:

I know from experiance that the show circuit seems to think that tie stalls are cruel because it does not allow free movement when in the barn.

it’s not just thought as a cruelty, in Germany (with the exception of Bavaria and Nordrhein Westfalen) it actually IS a violation of animal wellfare to keep a horse in a tie stall. Several studies prove that a large number of horses kept in a tie stall will develop abnormal behavior.

Some people argue that horses that work most of the day won’t mind to be kept in a tie stall but I think that especially a hard working horse deserves the space to lay down and stretch out completely for REM sleep phases to recover from the days work and be fresh and rested the next day (as the resting periods throughout the day have already been disrupted by the working hours). Also to have enough space to move a bit during the night.

If you’ve ever been forced to lay in a bed that’s too small for you to sleep comfortably after hard work you might be able to relate to that.

As for unused/wasted space resp. being able to keep more animals: a better solution – in my opinion – would be to tear down the separating walls between the boxes and create a “pen box” – combined with the paddock. This always done under consideration for the minimum space requirements for the individual animal:

according to german and swiss animal wellfare laws

Box stall: at least (2x height at withers)2

I can’t formate it correctly. It should read

(2x withers height) x (2x withers height)

For groups of 5 and more horses in one large pen the measurement of the pen can be reduced by maximum 20% – if the animals get along well with each other.

In large pens there’s another advantage: you don’t need to have the whole space filled with bedding. If you place a beam to stop the bedding from sliding through the whole box you can create a sleeping space with bedding and a walking/standing/eating place without bedding.

Several studies prove that a large number of horses kept in a tie stall will develop abnormal behavior.

I don’t see a problem with tie stalls any more than box stalls IF you are using and working with your horses. I have seen plenty of animals exhibiting abnormal behavior from standing in box stalls day after day. It seems to be the lack of interaction w/ others (human, horse, goat or whatever) that triggers this. Solitary confinement whether in a tie stall or box stall is still solitary confinement and extended periods under these conditions can not be good for the horse . Use them and interact with them or get rid of them – for their sake.

Tie Stall vs Box Stall vs Run-In Shed

There’s a book called “The Perfect Stall” by a vet, who owns Friesians, Karen E. N. Hayes. I saw her speak a couple years in a row. She knows her stuff on bedding horses. She studied at Cornell and has done a lot of research. Put pedometers on horses, checked for arthritis in joints and breathing problems too. Her findings are briefly these: Horses need to sleep flat down and out – on their sides – a few hours a day or they are not really sleeping. As the earlier writer said, they need to be down and out to get REM sleep. A horse that stands and sleeps is not sleeping. Not sleeping is stressful and takes a big toll on horses – think colic, ulcers, bad behavior, bad performance. Minimum stall size is 16 x 20. Anything less invites early arthritis in pasterns etc. Horses were built to move about 10 miles a day, wandering about and grazing. Again, stalling a horse is a colic, ulcer, bad behavior concern, Hayes says. Next, is the urine, manure issue. Cornell did studies of the air quality in stalls. In multi-million dollar barns in Kentucky, time and again air quality was far below OSHA minimum requirements for humans. Think urine – which is primariliy ammonia – in bedding and asking the animals not just to breathe from the stall floor but eat as well. Hayes said the ammonia readings are so high in most stalls that oxygen masks would be required if the cleaning of stalls was a manufacturing facility! In the wild, horses may eat 5 feet or so near manure, but move farther away from urine, she claims. She says if a horse is a “stall pig” it is because they are going nuts trying to bury their waste to get away from the smell and breathing problems. Cornell scoped 2 and 3 yr old multi-million dollar race horses in Kentucky that were box stalled most of the day and found them to have airway and lung damage of a horses much older as well as early signs of arthritis – joint stiffness, etc. Next on her hit list for elimination was bedding. She says it is bad for horses to lie in sawdust – they breathe in the fine particles and it clogs their airways and hurts lung capacity. All sawdust and bedding also contains chiggers that can cause allergies and skins problems, she says. Bed deep and it also negatively affects horse hooves – which need to be supported by earth. She urges humans to lie in sawdust some time and see how they like it. In the wild, horses have one or two others serve as a look out and the others sleep. They prefer to be on slightly elevated ground, on grass or knocked down tall grass. Horses whose heads are tied when eating or trailering cannot clear their airways. They need to drop their heads to the earth and blow out. Even if you set the hay feeder at breast height, a horse will snag hay then drop their heads low. Tie high and you are inviting penumonia. So, what is her solution? She recommends Run in stalls, with minimum 6 foot or so minimum wall height, that open to the air. Door height, if you want to shut them into their run in shed has to be at least 5 feet or they will try and jump it, she says. A mix of earth and peat moss for flooring, a minimum of sawdust/wood bedding on top of that, free access to a paddock or pasture for exercise. And let the horses see each other. She even urges people to get ceiling fans installed in the run in or box stalls – turned on lowest setting keeps bug off and moves ammonia smells out. I encourage folks to get a copy of Karen Hayes’ book. She says too many people literally kill their horses with kindness. Might as well get her and other vets’ recommendation for feeding in here too: Feeding 4 to 6 small meals of hay a day on a regular schedule is much better for your horse – helps prevent stress which leads to colic and ulcers – than once or twice a day. Theory is horses are grazing nibblers, not leopards loading up on a kill and their stomach acid is churning all the time. On a different but also important horse keeper note, – music in a barn. A study – not from this vet – shows horses can get sick from a radio playing in a barn – any kind of music. Think stress again. Horses crave quiet. They are always in fear of a cougar or some predator sneaking up on them. They want/need to be able to hear anything that is coming and they are herd animals who want/need to hear and talk with each other. Especially when they are being held captive in a stall and can’t see or hear others or even run away as Nature intended. Anyhow, take it or leave it. We all do the best we can. I certainly don’t have a perfect barn or stall. But I do the best I can with them. Sick horses cost money!!! Healthy ones are expensive enough! LOL

I see no reason to keep a horse in any type of stall. I have tie stalls for when I bring my horses in to feed before harnessing. As Donn described they are an efficient way to use the space. I have had a box stall, but turned it into two tie stalls for my oxen. I used the box stall for calvings in poor weather, and for an infirmed horse. Either way my horses are out except for one of two nights a month during winter, in case of freezing rain.

Tie stalls with feed lane in front, feed trough, alley way for harnessing and manure handling behind, with harnesses hung conveniently, with a box stall for emergency is my preference.

Carl