strange d-ring predicament

I often hook my team, or single with a choker, either on the cart or from an evener. This does have some risk for sure, but I have not personally had a choker come unhitched, though I have witnessed it happen with another team.

I started doing that as my horses are trained to stand with no contact, and being attached to a tree gives me some security that they will not end up under a tree I am falling. I will often cut a hitch, hook up, skid out onto the trail, stand the horses and go back to it another hitch, leaving them hooked standing in the skid way. That way I can get into a rhythm of skid, hitch, stand, cut.

This does not answer the real question about tying off. As you found out it is not a good practice to tie off horses while still hitched in harness. I do not keep halters on when in harness, but will unhitch from the cart, separate the horses, unbridled, halter and tie off. This often seems like too much for some folks, but it really only takes a few minutes, and really is the safest way to tie off in a working situation.

Also, we have had another thread recently about these clips catching in horses’ mouths. I use the old style downward facing holdback hooks, but it seems that others are using these side facing spring clips. I think it makes sense to use a different neck yoke with downward rings and hooks.

Carl

It seems that in most jockey yokes I have seen you can clip off the ring and slip the downward facing hooks right in. Might just need to reem them out a little. Also I believe Meader’s supply sells the downward facing hook. While not everyone needs to or wants to switch, I do think the se hooks are better.

Of course I have no real experience with leaving horses in the woods while I cut. I have run a saw a few times with them in the woods, but that is different that having a regular system. As Carl often mentions there is some element of risk with each of these systems. My Amish nieghbors have the typical team that will stand all day, corn choppers, belts, anything. Last winter they ran out of the wood lot and all the way home, a good mile from one farm to the next. He said it was because they were cold! I got to weld the arch back together.

I was showing some one how to tie a horse to a wall the other day. I pointed out the difference between tieing them long, short, high, or low. And the benefit of different knots. I think tieing a team in the woods while still hooked seems like a small risk, but not zero. I would look for a good sized tree and put it dead center in front of them. I would tie them high (+40″) with just enough rope to keep them safe if one fell or lay down. This system would not be fool proof. I would work carefully to built a teams ability to be tied this way.

Hooking a choker to a tree and the back of a cart is very different to me. It could be very secure and safe, but I would worry about horses moving around, or testing the hitch. A horse that tests a tye rope is reinforcing something they should have already learned “tied means tied”. The team hitched to some thing behind them with no one home is different, I would prefer that they never move or test the system, but if they do I am not sure what I am teaching at that point. “hooked to something solid means whoa?” I never taught them that.

I am just thinking out loud, taking the horses to the wood presents some real challenges. I am luck to be able to cut with the horses in the barn and skid separately. I got out of the habit of using halters under bridles and prefer the bridles that way, but I often still encourage other to use halters that way. In the last couple years I have had a three bridles made with halters built in. I like them a lot.

Another picture of the halter bridle and the aforementioned link…..

Bridle Halter Combo

This thread seems to have a couple of directions ,pardon me if I’m outa line Mule Man, I think the hooking a sled, forecart etc to something solid has a long history especially in the sugaring with horses era. when the sugarhouses were remote from the farm and the sapsled was the way home, the horses waited till the boiling was over to go home. I think they were being taught to wait for the teamster to “be” there before they were released from “something solid that means whoa ” ?

Mr Russell you may remember mr Illsley from up by you . He told me of a team that tried to go while hooked to an iron ring in a barn yard, one horse fell trying to go and the team never tested it again. Sometimes those one time lessons go better than other times.

I do think the risks are real with all these “remote keyless operating systems ”

Great thread.A few notes:
. Joel, I like my rigging as compact as possible and I have clipped directly into the “U” that holds the ring on a typical jockey yoke. I learned this from someone else (Another geezer on this site.). However, it is a very tight fit to get the harness hook in, tight enough that it lends itself neither to convenience nor safety. So I removed the “U”‘s from the end of the neckyokes and heated & reworked them to be longer, with round cross sections where they protrude beyond the wood to reduce wear on the harness clips. I resecured them with (probably) 8/24 or 32 bolts with the ends cut & peened over the nuts. That worked well for me.
I have since made my own neckyokes, based on the design I got from George. In my opinion my modifications are simpler with no sacrifice in functionality.
Speaking of keeping rigging straight, George’s photos reminded me of something. I use a very similar lever bit. I usually clip in the ring and occasionally in the first drop. I found the lines were getting caught up or snagged on the lever more often than I wanted, so I cut the levers down by one notch. It has made a significant difference in keeping things “straight” and, for me, if I need that third notch I plan to leave the horses in the barn.
And joining the chorus, safety is about managing risk. When I am in the woods with my horses, particularly if it has been weeks or months, I will tie their heads while cutting. I run halters under bridles. I am not a professional logger. After they get more comfortable, and more tired, I may leave them untied, particularly if I can do it with them facing away from the landing/barn. It all depends.
And managing winter work. If I have to dig out a tree to cut it down I am going to find something else to do. Maybe catch up on my DAPNet postings. That is one of the great benefit of having a diversified operation, including a gainfully employed wife!
I really appreciate this community. Stay safe all.
Mark

Joel, Regarding neck yoke clip safety, I have been clipping the side straps into the hames while ground skidding – seems like a safe way to keep them out of the way.

Marc, I have never had my lines caught on the lever. I usually hook one down from the ring. I do run my lines on drop rings clipped to my hames (double clip with a ring on one end). I wonder if that makes a difference?

Regarding excess snow, I have learned to push a little harder when the going is good and, like others, find other things to do when the snow is too deep.

George