[Carl Russell]

Hey guys, welcome aboard, Carl

[Carl Russell]

It’s great that George and Melissa enjoy the site, I just wanted to make sure this thread is on top at this category. Carl

[Carl Russell]

Welcome Heather, Great to see you here. You may be interested in the Seeds of Self Reliance program and newsletter posted in the Community Forum. Look forward to reading more from you. Carl

[Carl Russell]

Donn Hewes;1118 wrote:

…. This is much like what carl described with the tension up a lead rope technique…..

It just occurred to me this morning while milking (as always) that I may not have described this exercise quite right, as it is not tension in the rope that I am trying to describe.

A parable if I may; Many years ago I had a mare (still do, 22 years since) who was pretty bossy, and before me had been pushed around a lot by humans trying to dominate her. I used to say “you can put a piece of paper under every foot at the same time”. She just hovered.

At the same time there was an older man, well respected horseman, Floyd Fuller, who in his retirement traveled around the region floating horses teeth. As this mare was new to me, I thought she should have her teeth attended to. It was the first time I had met Floyd. He was 80ish (+/-), and an unassuming man with a generous and gentle demeanor. I had a healthy dose of apprehension about his being successful. She was in cross-ties (not all that restraining) and he just approached her, looked her in the eye, placed his hand on her nose, and gently slid the floating rasp into her mouth and started working off the sharp points.

I was astounded. I had know idea how he had done that, but I saw it happen. In fact he had done it to me too. My presence couldn’t have been anything but unhelpful, as I was convinced that she was going to explode. It was entirely through his presence that he was able to project to her his intension, and his capability, and his trustworthiness. I was bowled over with awareness, unable to describe it, or even understand it, but absolutely aware of it.

If you think of humans as energetic beings, we are emitting energy at all times. Some people may refer to this as an Aura, but it is also presence, demeanor, and attitude. If you can think of the energy being emitted from your body as having impact on those other energetic beings around you, then you may be able to imagine energy as an appendage, like an arm, that you can control, to have specific impact on others around you.

We do a lot of this involuntarily, like being shy, or angry, or amorous, or submissive. Because we have been trained to be so dependent on spoken language, we rarely understand the messages we are actually conveying through the energy of our body language.

The way this relates to the lead rope exercise is that energy vibrates. It travels in waves. Like sound waves, etc. The lead rope becomes the manifestation of the energy that you are emitting. When the rope is slack, and you are completely relaxed you are holding your energy, and not affecting anyone else, including the horse. As you wave the rope, you are sending energy waves up the rope directly at the horse. Low energy waves do not affect the horse, but as you put more and more energy into the waves, getting bigger and faster, your energy will begin to impact the horse. At a certain point your energy will be more than the horse is willing to resist, and they will move back.

You have shown the horse that you have control of your energy by escalating slowly, by concentrating that energy on that horse, and by immediately stopping when the horse yielded. This is communicating at the most basic level, body language. As you continue this exercise the horse will observe you increasing your intension, and will learn that it is safe for them to yield at even a very low level.

As I wrote before, the side effect is that you can also learn, by practicing the feeling that is the foundation for the body language that you emit. This feeling will become the presence that you carry with you, and the horses, cows, dogs, people around you will all respond to it.

The reason that I like this exercise, and I don’t do it a lot, is that I don’t have to touch the horse, or give any commands, or try to direct the horse in any way. It is pure and simply a demonstration of comfort, control, and communication. It has been the foundation for me in the way that I approach my horses. I think that I have a sense now of what Floyd projected to my mare. I can assume a presence that says I am here, I have intension, I am more determined than you, I am safe, and I am trustworthy, all at once.

This is not to say that I have nothing but success, this is not the case. However, the basis for constructive communication is well laid.

I think that it is important to recognize that in all of these different training techniques, the result should not be measured in how smoothly the animal crosses over, or follows, or yields, but how they perceive the teamster. Carl

[Carl Russell]

I expect my horses to yield in all directions. However, as I described, the rope exercise is pretty much all I do. The other yieldings all come from general interaction.

I really enjoy reading or watching some of the many techniques used by trainers, because it gives me food for thought, but as Plowboy writes, I also spend most of my interaction performing purposeful endeavors, and I incorporate some of those points emphasized in the books.

I really like reading Pat Perelli because I think he does a good job of fleshing out the rationale behind his techniques, and I can see their application in day-to-day working situations. So, no I haven’t followed his, nor Doc Hammell’s, nor any other lists, rather just picked up a few effective tools to accomplish my desired results.

As I have written before, one of the most effective ways to gain respect from animals is through initiative. By having purpose, I find that I demonstrate an awareness and competency that is attractive to horses, and steers, and dogs,etc.

I caution against using training techniques too much as a way to gain respect from animals, as by relying on these practice sessions we can adopt body language that presents ourselves as desirous of respect, which will give the horse reason to question the objective. Real working conditions give the teamster an opportunity to demonstrate their prowess and control of the situation, which I have found to be very effective.
Carl

[Carl Russell]

Standing facing the horse, with a long lead rope (10′-12′) or lunge line, start slowly waving the rope, sending waves up the rope toward the horse. Limit the body language, no verbalization, just focus on starting with low energy, looking for the slightest try demonstrating that the horse is yielding to your energy by stepping back. As your energy escalates, you will force more energy through the rope (so to speak) by waving more rapidly, and energetically. You may have to become extremely demonstrative before the horse yields, but with one true step back, immediately stop and relax. This is the reward, and it is the clear message of how you will use your energy when the horse does yield. As you repeat this, the horse will yield at lower and lower thresholds. When they yield easily at low energy, you can start reinforcing with voice commands. And it will be the basis for any other situations where you desire yield, like bit pressure, stall manners, etc.

It has been a long time since I saw this demonstrated by a true expert, but it was a huge eye opener for me. An incredible side effect of this exercise is that I learned how to comfortably control my energy so that the escalation was methodical and not complicated by frustration or anger, both of which will provide the same result, but it is very difficult to see the result with clear vision, and also very difficult to release the highly charged energy that you are emitting, thereby wasting the opportunity, and conditioning for all the wrong things.

Yielding is the most basic, and in my mind the most important, reflection of respect. I get concerned about understanding the difference between training behavior through repetition, and true respect. Any animal will learn to follow your lead, but may never truly develop respect, or trust. Getting a horse to yield, and rewarding the yield, is communication based on mutual respect, and is very different from domination/submission, or Pavlovian response. Carl

[Carl Russell]

I don’t spend a lot of time on “ground rules” so to speak. I definitely have behaviors that I don’t accept, like nipping, threatening, pushing me around, but I am bored by repetitive exercises.

I usually just work on yielding. The exercise that I really like is sending energy through a lead rope to get them to step back. It has been all I have needed to do. Basically they need to know that I have expectations, and I will back them up with an escalation of energy, until they yield easily.

This is the foundation for all other behavior corrections. So when they do something I don’t want them to repeat, they get reminded that they need to yield to me, and when they do, they get lots of lovin’.

Then their attention is always on me and what I’m doing, and I reinforce that by returning the attention.

I like my animals to show enthusiasm, for work, for fun, for food. I really try hard not to deaden that. There is a difference between being enthusiastic, and being disrespectful. Carl

[Carl Russell]

The problem you describe is why the other hitch styles have been developed. The only way that I found to unhitch a log hanging on a hitch slot was with a peavey. By levering under the butt of the log, or by putting the hook in a link and prying up to release tension. Both of these require some power though as you need both hands.

I modified my old slot type log cart by welding a 3″ pipe onto the frame behind the slot bar. With the top of the pipe level with the bottom of the slots, and back 2-4″, the choker goes straight from the slot then hangs over the pipe down to the log. This way all the way of the log can hang on the chain, and the chain can be flipped out of the slot similarly to the Barden design. If a log is really heavy then the chain can be pried out of the slot with the point on the peavey. Good luck Carl

[Carl Russell]

I am leaning toward selected teamsters, demonstrating techniques and equipment, thanks for the reinforcement. More please.

We are certainly planning to have staged demos on the fairgrounds on Sat. & Sun, but the real work demos are critical to the substance that we are striving for. Some of it is limited to the pieces that are brought.

I am thinking of different sections of the farm under work by several teams and singles accomplishing work using specifically important equipment (new/used), where spectators can observe.

I like the workshop scenario, but I would love to see a quantity of work being completed. I also want to make accommodation for equipment dealer/makers than want to have their stuff shown off. I think we could have enough room where “intensives” can go on while other teams are just doing the work.

We do have to get a more expensive insurance policy, so I need to figure out the funding of this aspect of the enterprise. We will charge for attendance, but I wonder if this venue would be valuable enough to dealer/makers to pay exhibitor fees? The insurance isn’t the only cost, as we are using people’s land and there will be a fair amount of set up time.I guess the workshop part could bring more value.

Daylight Savings!!!! I’m already late tomorrow, and I haven’t even gone to bed yet. Carl

[Carl Russell]

Boy! Will somebody turn on the lights in here? It seems like we’re all grasping for something, but we can’t find it. Carl

[Carl Russell]

I have had friends correct me that they do not have Canadian “Chunks”, they have Canadians! It seems that the “chunk” is nomenclature left over from the period when “chunk” was used to describe the small chunky grade cross that populated so many pre-tractor farms. Carl

[Carl Russell]

When they are tired, they do appreciate the rest, but that is really only part of it because a tired horse can be a trouble maker. I find that it has a lot to do with a clear distinction about the role of the command. If the teamster rattles on, or gives the animals little chance to react to a command before issuing another, then they lose respect and develop a sense of complacency.

Just like picking up feet, you hold it up, but even though your objective is to hold it for as long as you want, you need to put it down before the horse tries to take it back. Repeat and extend the time gradually.

Working horses that won’t stand with the expectation that they should stand while some other work is getting done, is only training them to get bored and fidget. They need to be taught that standing is an exercise like everything else you have them do.

If the teamster uses whoa as a way to have a chance to pay attention to something else, then the horses will know that they are on their own. When they know that they are on task whenever in harness, then standing will be their job.

Whoa should be administered as a reward, but it is not freedom. If they are prone to fidgeting, then practice stopping them long enough for them to relax, but before they get bored, be prepared with a movement task, like breaking trail while the crew taps out a loop, and come back and pick them up in a couple of minutes.

Sap running? Carl

[Carl Russell]

Erik, is it only when she is waiting or wanting to be fed? or something like “scratches” that causes her to stamp a hind foot, almost involuntarily? The scratches can be treated, however I must say I have had only mixed results.

The “feed me” stamping, (and Pawing?) I’ve noticed is a kind of boredom thing. I used to keep my horses in a lot and found the stamping and pawing annoying and perplexing. Now that they are out except in freezing rain, “they don’t stamp the barn floor”. They also aren’t inclined to stamp when in.

I was told to solve the “feed me” behavior by not going to the barn only at feeding time. In essence ignoring the message and presenting yourself as having other things to do there, “it’s not all about you honey!”. It seemed to have worked.

This may not help, but it is my experience. Carl

[Carl Russell]

Someone else will have to respond about laminating wood for yokes, but I know that “slide” yokes were built in sections out of hardwood, and bolted together, so I think it could work. I wonder why you would finish it with softwood though? Cost? Carl

[Carl Russell]

Hi Rob,

Great report. There’s nothing like a can-do attitude when pushing the envelope with animals. I also liked reading that you went back to the rope halter. I think too often people get into the mindset that once the fundamentals are completed they are done with. It is a great exercise to take these critters back to the beginning sometimes to make your point. Thanks for sharing. Good luck. Carl

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