[Donn Hewes]

Hi frank, I am glad the horses are doing better. Having the lines three holes off will definitely make one or both of them hold their head a little funny. The stub lines (part of team lines that cross between the horses) should be 8″ longer than the draft lines (the part that goes to the outside of each horse), for a 42″ yoke and evener. A longer evener would require a longer stub line, and a shorter one would require a shorter stub line. This assumes you are not using spreaders (a string of rings attached to the hames). As spreaders move the horses apart also the stub lines would be shorter to compensate.

[Donn Hewes]

Hi Frank, There are several possiblities and as usual it is very hard to say from this distance. Do you have any one you have been working with helping you as you get started. I am assuming you are just getting started, and if so some one with an experienced eye can be a valuable asset.

Here are some possibilities in no particular order. One or both of the stub lines (check lines) are not crossing in between the horses as they should. These lines are usually a few inches longer than the other depending on the set up. You are hitched to a different implement with a different length evener or neck yoke. Lamness? Is it possible that nothing is different from last year and the horse is just looking around. What are you hooking to?

I could think of more but my wife is dragging me out to dinner. let us know how you make out. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

Horses can be great grazers. In following lambs we have found they clean off the grasses and other stuff that the lambs left and don’t really bother the legumes and other good plants the lambs just shortened. Using tread in posts, and poly wire reels is helpful in making it fast to set up a new break for horses. Aside from a young animal or a pregnant mare, we feed almost no grain to our work animals. None in the winter, and a handful as a reward when they come in the barn each morning in the summer. With all this dry weather we have already started night grazing a few of the areas that are usually too wet to graze. Who would have thought the horses would be out before the sheep. Sheep will start to graze this week. Gotta fix some fence first. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

Hi Jean, If you aren,t already on your way to AK. I am in Cortland Co. NY. I am sure you can find much more interesting plowing closer to home, although like Joe I hate to discourage anyone form baking a pie! I don’t know where you are in VT. but if I was up that way I would like to go over to Erik Andrus’ to watch the plowing. If you end up in Central NY. I hope to be plowing in the second half of April but it could be anytime. I have about 60 spreader loads of compost witch are a higher priority once the fields dry out a little.

[Donn Hewes]

D ring harnesses alleviate tongue slap? This is an attribute that Les should make a bigger emphasis in his talk. The fact that they take away tongue weight from the neck is obvious. For those who feel tongue weight isn’t a problem for them, tongue slap might be a different issue. A really good demonstration would be to lay a half round of fire wood infront of one of the tires of a fore cart and drive over it. that would demonstrate how that harness deals with tongue slap. I don’t think correctly fitting a traditional western brichen harness (correct term?) does anything to prevent tongue slap. If you have a well loaded two wheeled cart and you hit a good root with one wheel the tongue has a lot of lateral load.

[Donn Hewes]

Hi Carl, Here are a couple more ideas I had for NEAPFD. I am thinking about a hoof care demonstration. I think it would be great to join up with a farrier who would talk about how, why, and when to shoe your work animals. Then I would could talk about how and why a farmer would trim their own horses. together we could show people the hoof and the basics of hoof care.

Also, I would like to present a power point presentation on how and why we graze our horses and mules on our sheep dairy. I hope my wife, Maryrose, will join me in Vt. and we can present this together but she has not commited yet.

Anyway, two more ideas for the hopper. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

yes the fit of the collar is probably the most important fit of the work harness. Here are some observations from other mentors and my own experience.

I almost alway use a pad. I would happily work a horse with out one but I seldom find one that fits that well. With a pad I like the collar a little closer on the sides of the neck. You still need room to breath at the bottom even when you gently push the collar into the work position, but I don’t want a gap to put my fingers in on the sides. I should be able to easily slide my fingers in at the side but not a gap. another test for the side is, after you push the collar to the shoulders lift it toward the head with one hand at the bottom. It should lift easy, with out resistance, like it was draging on the neck. If it feels tight it is too tight. This from many old mentors. More animals were made sore from loose collars than tight.

I like adjustable collars for all the reasons listed before, also if you are buying one for a three or four year old you will want to make it bigger next year. I use to use the standard deer hair sweat pad. They would be soaked in the middle of the day. I didn’t have pads to change out. I now use, and much prefer, the foam and vinyl “healing” pad. The vinyl goes against the horse and acts much more like the leather, It doesn’t absorb any sweat. They have the regular blue and white ticking on the out side.

Finally, make sure the breast strap to brichen connection is the right length. If it is too long the collar will lift with any backing or stoping and this is just like wiggleing around in your shoes, sure to give you a blister. After you put the harness on grab the yoke snap and pull it forward, It should come down in a straight line from the hames but “not” angle in front of the hames. That’s when it will lift the collar. I grab it every time I put on a harness, it let’s me know if I twisted a quarter strap, or if I need to adjust a harness. Maybe I won’t do that all summer but it is a good habit once in a while.

[Donn Hewes]

I have had many of the same experiences as others. A walking plow can be one of the great pleasures of working with horses. It can also be difficult to get horses started that have never plowed before. You keep stopping to make corrections and they never get a sense of what you are trying to do. A couple of observations I have made in my limited experience with plowing are Long furrows are better than short ones; and plowing sod or old pasture is much harder work than plowing in last years garden.

On our current farm no one had plowed for many years. Mostly because we are a hill top, pasture based dairy farm. all our gardens have been close to the house and dug with a shovel or a rototiller. Last year I wanted plow a 1/4 acre to experiment with some new crops. I have a good walking plow, and I tried different combinations of horses and mules. The plow didn’t scour very quickly and the horses and mules were all over the place, but we made some furrows (all my former plow horses have passed away and this was a first time for all these). Then I borrowed an old trailer plow from a neighbor. These are plows on wheels that were towed behind old style tractors before three point hitches became popular. With two twelve inch bottoms this hooked great to a fore cart. It has a rope you pull from the seat of the fore cart that trips the plows and down they go. Pull it again and they pop out of the ground. It was a lot of load for three on the fore cart, but they did it. This year I may try it with fore up.

I only mention it as another cheap alternative, there are alot of these trailer plows (some with a single bottom) in the hedge row as well. Like a sulky plow, you can set the depth and go in a straight line, so they make it much easier for a novice or horses that are new to plowing to make a good looking job. That is plowing pasture sod also.

[Donn Hewes]

Les is a teamster from New Hampshire that has a video available that explains the uses and advantages of the D ring harness. He gave a great presentation at last years NEAPFD. I don’t think he is a harness maker himself but I am sure he would know where to get one. Do you have harness allready or are you just planning to get harness? What equipment do you have or hope to use with the donkeys? How big are they and how much do you think they weigh? Is there a specific task that you think has to much tongue weight? These are just some of the questions I would ask if I were thinking about buying a different type of harness. hopefully we will hear from of the D ring users in the group.

[Donn Hewes]

It sounds like a good idea – just got to make sure it fits right and is adjusted right. Go right to the source, get a hold of Les Barden.

[Donn Hewes]

For those that want to spend a little more time teaching their animals to yield I have found the rope halter to be a valuable new tool. This halter is constructed with several knots designed to rest on specific pressure points on the horses head. With the addition of a long lead rope there are many diffferent yeilding techiques you can work on.

These techniques were offered to me as a possible solution for a mule that wasn’t working all that well. Pulling on the bit, ground manors not that good , etc. Intially I was resistant because I saw it as ground work for saddle horses and I was a farmer. I saw were you could teach the animal which foot to cross over and lots of other stuff I wasn’t sure applied to farming with horses and mules. Eventually I realized however that my mule was “locking up” everything from her jaw, to her head, neck, and everything else. Rather than try to address this issue with a harness, bridle, bit, and all the rest, I could first address it with just the rope halter and a lead rope.

The first technique I accepted was asking the mule to yield her head to the side with out moving her feet. At first you go around in a circle, but you continually look for any oppurtunity to reward them giving their head to you by giving a little slack. As with any training, as your skill and understanding grows it becomes easier to get the desired results. Over time you are trying to get the animal to yield with the least amount of pressure possible. This is much like what carl described with the tension up a lead rope technique. This one concept of yielding her head was like a revolution for this mule and I have not let her forget it. getting her to yield was the first step in getting her to relax in harness.

Right now I use it to teach an animal to put their head down, lead, back, yield their head to each side and change directions by turning toward me while circleing at a walk. I know for different horses and different activities this is just the tip of the iceberg for this training method. So far this is all I have felt might be useful to my work animals. I don’t spend a lot of time on it, maybe five or ten minutes a day. I don’t want anyone to mistake this for the work we are doing.

In the past I have always been one to get them in harness and then let the training happen. Start with something simple and work your way up. I still believe in that, but now I might use a few minutes with the rope halter for a trainee. It gives them a chance to remember they are paying attention to me know before I ask for something new or expand on what they have done before.

I don’t even know the proper name for these methods if there is one, or who to credit for them, as they were shown to me by a friend. I am sure some one here knows more about it than I do.

[Donn Hewes]

There are a couple of problems with ground driven PTO’s that have prevented there wider use (so far). I have never owned one but I helped friends with an Elmo Reed (the state of the art then – not made any more) many years ago, and have always paid close attention to them at HP days. These are the problems as I see them.
First, the carts work well for all the lighter kinds of work like raking, tedding, etc. These jobs can all be done well without any PTO. Now a heavier cart with more traction is needed to do work like mowing with a haybine or baling. A lighter cart is more likely to loose traction on these jobs. A heavier cart is less appealing for the lighter work.
Second problem, you need extra horses. Four horses can pull a ground driven PTO cart and a baler, but four horses can pull a gas/desiel powered PTO cart, and a baler, and a wagon load of hay. This sounds like I want to trade horses for gas, which I don’t but we all have to decide what we think is efficient. I believe I will stop useing gas to make hay eventually and I think I will do it with loose hay, not a ground driven PTO cart.
I don’t say this to discourage anyone from trying to make one work. These are just some of that thoughts I had over the years as I looked at how I made hay, how I wanted to make hay next year, and how I might make hay in the future.

[Donn Hewes]

Carl, I think it sounds great so far. I would like to bring my Forecart to the hay making area, if that will help. I would need a teamster or team of four abreast (also a baler with flat wagon or haybine would be good) to show it. It is a good example of farm built / local amish welding shop construction. It has a honda engine, foot pedal hyd, three wheels ( no tongue weight, sliding tongue for three and five horse hitches, a four horse neck yoke, and I am in the process of adding hyd brakes. Doesn’t discourage people from a factory built model but may give some options.

[Donn Hewes]

Hi Carl, Here is my two cents worth. I have been to the HP days several times and had a great time each time. I think we could do something a little different and be something a little different (partly because they already do what they do.) I would like to see Friday events more like large workshops open to any NEAPFD visitor. Have them be farmer/logger lead and oriented toward what it takes to get the work done, not just the new equipment. Include the new equipment for sure, but also rebuilt and repaired, and include discussion/ questions about how farmers use the animals and equipment to get their work done.
Are you planning to still show the equipment at the fair grounds, I would as it provides an outlet for those that just want to see the stuff go. This is also important for the equipment dealers to demo to as large a group as possible.
I like to see everones horses as much as they next guy but I think that is better for a club sized event. For an event of this size I would stick with invited teams. I could be convinced otherwise about that.
Those are just some first thoughts, let us know if you want more. let us know how we can help. Donn

[Donn Hewes]

One thing I have gone out of my way to do, and think you were doing it today, is creating oppurtunities to teach standing. Many times I find with the short duration of certain farm tasks the horses don’t get alot of chances to practice standing. Just like anything else, you want to gradually build their ability to stand well. Some friends of mine were doing alot of garden cultivating and other light work for an hour or two at a time. They wanted to know how I got my horses to stand so well. We realized that their horses often went back to the barn with out having a chance to stand for very long. With a young team (or a new team) I will stop to talk to someone, pretend to be adjusting harness, or stand in front of them. Next time I will stand on the other side, or do something else. It may sound like I am waisting time but Standing well, (tired or not) is a critical skill for good farm horses in my opinion, and not one they learn over night but one they get better and better at as they are trained. Never skip a chance to make them stand.

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